The Forbidden Fruit

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Permalink Reply by ShantiShanti on April 25, 2008 at 4:22pm

I am thinking that yes, the forbidden fruit could be the concious mind, but that also Eden is not necessarily within us. I do believe in an actual, physical garden of Eden, also of an actual, physical Fountian of Youth. Am I crazy? LOL!! Who knows and really, REALLY who cares? But I think that the BELIEF in such is the main thing. What do you think Molando?

ShantiShanti

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Permalink Reply by Molado on April 25, 2008 at 7:45pm

i know there are people who go days and months without any solid food. ;-) yet, people's beliefs across the world are all so different to have something solid that can be shared on earth together unless we make it back to eden. but i don't believe we'd allow it. we are just too linearly oriented. :)

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Permalink Reply by Wizardoftrance on April 26, 2008 at 11:55am

To my understanding, the Adam and Eve story is a metaphor for our development from children to adults. The "fruit" of the tree of knowledge represents our experiencing of sex, and moving on into adulthood. This is the reason we will live by the sweat of our brow.. representing the effort that supporting ourselves and our families requires. The pain of child birth came into play because as children it is uncharted territory and a consequence of tasting the fruit. The same still holds true with our society today.. our children are forbidden to taste the "fruit" of the tree of knowledge of adulthood, until they are willing to strike out on their own and live by the sweat of their own brows, and suffer the pain of childbirth. Eve is the bad guy in the story because....well...you know what snake she was talking to... and HER needs just weren't being satisfied ;)

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Permalink Reply by Erik Blazynski on April 27, 2008 at 6:39pm

So are you asking if the author of the story is using the forbidden fruit as a metaphor for our conscious mind. No I don't think so. I don't understand the representation. I think the story is supposed to explain the origins of humans and the roll of the concepts of good and evil have in this world. But maybe you could better explain the metaphor of how this relates to the conscious mind.

And not be be a jerk, but what does this have to do with hypnosis? I think we need regular forums so that we can categorize off topic posts.

-Erik

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Permalink Reply by Molado on April 27, 2008 at 9:57pm

hi erik, no you are not being a jerk. ;) btw, i don't believe i need to explain anything here. also, as a side note, don't you think everything has to do with hypnosis? let's not so linear here. when we think about it in other way, we might be able to see how it's related, but then again, it's your choice. happy dreams and thank you for your input. ;)

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Permalink Reply by Molado on April 27, 2008 at 9:59pm

hi serge, yes, i agree. there's some big chunk of meat missing here and that's where all the fun is. i noticed this sort of searching a lot with clients, especially with age regression. thanks for the food. ;)

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Permalink Reply by Molado on April 27, 2008 at 10:03pm

hi wizardoftrance, isn't metaphor great? that's why i guess we used them, to rid of our responsibilities and guilt? :) thank you for your honest input. i'll always remember it.

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Permalink Reply by Erik Blazynski on May 4, 2008 at 5:31pm

Well in the story didn't they consciously make the decision to eat the fruit? Wouldn't this mean that they had conscious thought to make that decisions? If not then they would have instinctively eaten the fruit, and this would mean that "god" gave them instinctive drive to eat the fruit and this would either make "god" cruel, OR flawed.

-Erik

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Permalink Reply by Molado on May 5, 2008 at 9:38am

hi Erik,

thank you for your input again. :) i do really enjoy. well, my question would be then first, were they really conscious? i mean is there any chance that they could've "tricked" into taking the fruit? my second is then can you hypnotize or convince someone doing things they would "normally" wouldn't do? :)

happy thoughts.

deeply, molado

p.s. therefore, any god has nothing to do here nor in any question. :)

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Permalink Reply by Erik Blazynski on May 5, 2008 at 10:32am

If they did not posses consciousness prior to this and they were tricked into it then this would be like tricking a dog to walk off a cliff. It is absolutely possible but how can the dog be blamed or held accountable for his actions? And what god would punish an unconscious being for succumbing to trickery from a conscious being.

Re: being able to hypnotize someone to do something that they "normally" would not do. In my training I was told that this is not possible. But I totally disagreed then. But now I agree, but I also believe that you can be hypnotized to redefine "normal." Here is my supporting argument.

Take the military for instance. If I were to tell an average 18 yr. old kid to go and kill someone, don't ask questions just do it, and then pointed to a random person on the street, a vast majority would NOT do it. However when they are sent to boot camp and re-programmed to follow orders and the power of group empathy is employed, these powerful forces transform these otherwise normal individuals into obedient killers. They do not ask questions, they take another human life and in many cases rejoice. Then one of these guys kills a little puppy (maybe you've seen that video) and people freak out. WTF do you expect you trained him to kill. You've taken "normal" and redefined it.

So what does that say about the rest of us? The majority of our population are all hypnotized into believing that "The Enemy" (whomever has been demonized that month) are inherently bad people, whose lives are somehow worthless. Turn on the news any day of the week and you will see it, it is impossible to escape.

Example number 2 - Modern advertising - Shortly after WWII Edward Bernays was hired by the US government to manipulate our population, and the Department of Public Relations was created. Department of propaganda was too Hitleresque. And so Bernays set out to create the public relations and advertising industry designed to manipulate people by appealing to their unconscious desires, this is when people started buying things on a large scale because of the perception that they NEEDED something, when in fact these things that they "needed" were not actual necessities but "needs" manufactured by advertising.

So we are taught that people will not do anything that they are morally opposed to doing, and it is good to point this out to clients so that they are not freaking out that you are doing to get them to do something evil. I tell all of my clients this, but I don't tell them that they can move that line of morality, it is never my intention to do so and they need to feel at ease.

-Erik

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Permalink Reply by Molado on May 5, 2008 at 1:19pm

hi Erik,

thank you! i admire your blazing enthusiasm.

the dog can be blamed if it's the rule (of universe, for example) and/or
also, the dog can be blamed when it was trained not to walk over the cliff.

Re: being able to hypnotize someone to do something that they "normally" would not do.

would and want are not the same. you have responded me as if i said want. :)

in any case, ease down. :) life is grand. i did a little piece for Marlyn. check out http://youtube.com/watch?v=unet9pJhda8

btw, you were taught right. but i don't know about others who taught you or others of others of others... :) just kidding.

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Permalink Reply by Erik Blazynski on May 5, 2008 at 4:23pm

If I created a false floor or a cantilevered plywood that they dog walked on to as a trick then I would not place blame with the dog. Especially if there was a big steak out there. I just don't think that a merciful god would do that. But I guess this is where we disagree.

Oh my bad on the second question "my second is then can you hypnotize or convince someone doing things they would "normally" wouldn't do? :)"

I interpreted the question assuming that you had placed an extra would or wouldn't in the question, I didn't realize you were intentionally obfuscating. Nice one man you got me.

-Erik

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