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Advanced Coversational Hypnosis by Igor Ledochowski- YOUR OPINION?
What do you think about this course?
Have you ever had experience using techniques provided in this course?
Do you have any important observations or ideas after using them?
Thanks for sharing any thought (the best Hypnothought;))))
Tags: advanced, conversational, hypnosis, igor, ledochowski
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Craig Eubanks on -
Graham Old said:
Craig, my understanding is that Clifford Mee does Igor's marketing - completely with red text, yellow highlighter and 'offer ends soon' insults to our intelligence.
(I say all that as a genuinely big Igor fan.)
I doubt that David would lie to my face about working with Igor while we were having lunch. But anything is possible.
As for insulting your intelligence, that is how you choose to react to it. Not one copywriter I know sits down and says "hmmm, how can I insult people's intelligence today".
Instead they think, "how can I craft a sales message that will convert better than anything else".
These guys measure, track and test down to the penny. They know what converts prospects to buyers.
They don't give a crap about looking pretty, or looking professional, or trying to make everybody happy. If your marketing is good it's almost guaranteed to piss somebody off. As Dan Kennedy would say, if you don't have thick skin you shouldn't be an entrepreneur.
Cheers,
Craig
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Permalink Reply by Craig Eubanks on
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Brian David Phillips said:
Craig, I assume Scott's comment about Igor's marketing was less about his copywriting than about some of the affiliate practices. There are a number of hypnotists I know who have had their videos stolen and edited with any identifying information removed and then links to Igor's affiliate links selling his course. When this has been brought to Igor's attention, the hypnotists are usually referred to Clifford Mee who says that he can't be held responsible for affiliate actions. To the best of my knowledge the affiliates are not penalized or taken off the program and they do repeat the practice.
It has been awhile since this has happened to me - at least that I am aware of - so Igor could have finally done something about his affiliates and marketers being unscrupulous, or perhaps I just haven't found the violating materials yet.
- Brian
Hey Brian,This is an epidemic for anyone who has affiliates. And also anyone who has info-products. There is no easy answer because you don't actually know where your affiliates are advertising and how.
I've done affiliate management for people who have hundreds to thousands of affiliates. You do your best to make sure they represent you well, but the tools aren't there to be able to track them across every marketing channel.
I've had friends who have had their product and websites ripped off word for word and found the product show up on ebay and other places. Then you gotta get out the lawyers and DMCA act and all kinds of crap which is fine in the USA, then these guys go overseas.
Can't blame Igor for that one. Sorry you had the experience with your material. But you should feel lucky it's only been a few minor instances and you haven't had to get out the big gun pit bull lawyers to try and stop them.
Cheers,
Craig
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Permalink Reply by Kathleen Hanover on
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Hi Craig,
I'd be THRILLED if you could get David Garfinkel on a call. I LOVE his work. But I have a feeling you and I are the only people here who may have heard of him.
Kathleen Hanover
Marketing, PR and Copywriting Opinionist
Craig Eubanks said:I might be able to get David on an upcoming Hypnothoughts Marketing & Practice Building Teleseminar if enough people were interested.
Cheers,
Craig
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Permalink Reply by Ian Collins on -
Well. This is nice to read so many posts but well... again topic goes into like-dislike Igor's marketing, not into value of his courses. That is pity because it seems to happen all the time (I have read discussions in several places) as if we were programmed somehow to talk about that only.
This is funny- and I will probably try to contact Igor personally and talk about that... it seems that he influenced people so hard... that they can not talk about anything but marketing and forget about courses and materials:))
Well- this could be great. Let's imagine... you publish some stuff. Does not metter what value. You make a marketing...and then people are talking about marketing only, causing others to try to find answers stronger and stronger....forcing them to search more... to find again that everyone seems to talk about marketing:)))
And at the end, those guys buy the product at the end...
This seems to me a perfect redirection idea:))
To redirect attention to something else, so no one tries to disprove you are right... but talks about HOW you sell it:)))I would love to experience that as an author of... of anything:))) because it does not matter "what" anymore:))))
What do you think?
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Permalink Reply by macka on -
Im pretty sure Igor did a master class interview with a copy right guy. The one he actually uses. It probably was David Garfinkel. On the interview he sounded like an old guy but new much about how the written word gets into peoples minds.
He there differences between talking face to face and the written word. I think even Igor didnt know some of the tricks that guy new.
Kathleen Hanover said:Hi Craig,
I'd be THRILLED if you could get David Garfinkel on a call. I LOVE his work. But I have a feeling you and I are the only people here who may have heard of him.
Kathleen Hanover
Marketing, PR and Copywriting Opinionist
Craig Eubanks said:I might be able to get David on an upcoming Hypnothoughts Marketing & Practice Building Teleseminar if enough people were interested.
Cheers,
Craig
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Permalink Reply by Graham Old on -
Craig,
You'll have to point out to me where I said that anyone had lied to you.
Craig Eubanks said:I doubt that David would lie to my face about working with Igor while we were having lunch. But anything is possible.
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Permalink Reply by Brian David Phillips on -
Craig, perhaps David has done work with him but Clifford had been running the account for quite some time. Both being involved in different capacities would not be mutually exclusive, or perhaps he's changed his accounts and practices. When I contacted Igor about the copyright theft done by affiliates, he referred me to Clifford as the person running his affiliate marketing programs. Fair call that when an affiliate program grows that it becomes difficult to track everyone involved, but the feeling of immediate action and taking responsibility for removing those who are caught using unethical practices is very important as well. It has been a few years since I had the issue I posted about above.
Ian, the marketing discussion usually occurs when Igor's materials are brought up because they affect how folks perceive the material. Sometimes it is not just the material that folks recommend regarding a product or service, it is the person and the relationship. Perhaps as his success has continued Igor has managed to learn to bridge that gap better.
While folks I know who have purchased the material are usually very satisfied with it, the marketing experiences often color perception of general business practices.
Craig is correct that high calibre marketers test everything they do and track success. While Igor's advert copy leaves some cold and gives the impression of just another one of the scam products, it seems to not reflect the actual course value. Of course, the marketing copy is not aimed at folks who are already in the hypnosis community who have a strong sense of who Erickson really was and what hypnosis can genuinely do. For the market niche Igor seems to target, his copy seems to be very successful.
- Brian
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Permalink Reply by Graham Old on
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Really? I'd be gutted. And embarrassed.
It doesn't have to be like that. Richard Nongard removed his affiliate scheme because people were abusing it. That shows a commendable level of integrity.
Anyway, you said that people were talking about the marketing and not the product. However, if you read back through the thread I think you'll find almost universal praise for the product.
And that surely highlights part of the problem. It is virtually impossible to find a single objective review of Igor's products on the web. After wading through page after page (in fact, site after site) of affiliate sales pages, you may then stumble upon a review... only to discover that it's really a sales page in disguise.
The products are excellent - and that's true of every product of his that I've purchased. But I don't think that it's actually possible to talk about them without talking about the marketing, because that's the nature of such marketing.
Ian Collins said:I would love to experience that as an author of... of anything:))) because it does not matter "what" anymore:))))
What do you think?
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Permalink Reply by Joshua Johnston on
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Craig, you're right that marketers test and retest everything and I know that long form sales letters tend to work really well. I still have never been a fan of them and usually skim down to the summary and price. If I'm looking at the letter in the first place, it's because I'm interested in the idea and anything that slows me down in making a decision on it only annoys me. Plus, I hate getting really interested in it only to find out it costs $499 and is thus completely out of my range.
That said, I do completely agree with the comments about the actual product. Igor does a great job with what he puts out, though sometimes the audio volume leaves a bit to be desired (keeping in mind that I'm hard of hearing, of course). He breaks things down in to easy to understand chunks and gives good exercises and examples of everything.
Joshua
PS. Speaking of long form sales letters, they aren't the only thing that works. Charles Trippy proved that in Next Internet Millionaire; though he lost, he did much, much better than expected with a video and a very short letter. And Todd Gross routinely only uses video and relatively short emails and does quite well.
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Permalink Reply by Craig Eubanks on
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Video sales letters are replacing long form WRITTEN sales letters online, but it's important to realize the video is saying exactly the same sales message.
Because we are now a generation of TV addicts, the video saying the EXACT same message is converting at about 30% higher rates in an A/B split test.
People don't read much anymore, but they watch video constantly. TV, Movies, DVDs, iPhone, iPad, Sports Bars, on Airplanes.
It is critical to separate the MESSAGE from the MEDIA. It's not video that video sells better, it's that video is a better media to deliver the same message.
Email marketing is a different critter. If you attended my recent presentations at the Mid-America Conference or the NGH I covered how to effectively use Email Marketing to get more clients.
The quick & dirty answer is, shorter emails are more effective because of the ADD caused by sitting in front of a computer. If they don't read it IMMEDIATELY and think "I'll read this later" it almost never happens.
And there is a style and method to creating emails people WANT to read. So they look forward to your email every day.
Cheers,
Craig
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