Can hypnosis help when it comes to mental illness?

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Permalink Reply by Henxy on October 23, 2009 at 8:15am

That's an interesting perspective. Please share more.

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Permalink Reply by Jake Shannon The-Hypnotist.com on October 23, 2009 at 1:11pm

I write about it extensively in my new book but you can learn more by viewing the CCHR website and googling Dr. Thomas Szasz...

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Permalink Reply by Jackie Spencer on October 23, 2009 at 9:50pm

A client came to me for weight loss, telling me she was already seeing a psychologist. I sent a referral to the Dr. and it was a very good thing I did. The first weight loss session threw some red flags up right away. When the psychologist called me, she let me know that what I was doing (with all good intention, not knowing this client is a much deeper well than I had suspected) could have undone years of therapy. This doc and I are now a team and I report to her after each session. My suggestion: if you're working in close communication with a mental health expert and have safe boundaries for your own therapy, yes, this could be a wonderful client. Without good communication with a doctor, stay away.

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Permalink Reply by Susan French on November 10, 2009 at 5:38am

Hi Dennis,

My hat is off to you and I might even wash your feet in rosewater for being a thought-ful and brave and honest enough person to think about a response or reaction you had and come back to apologize or retract. I love you for it. It is a trait I highly value and one by which I measure maturity.

Thanks again for coming back and telling us that you thought something over. Kudos and hugs.

Susan

Dennis Atkinson said:

Hi Henxy. I wanted to respond to what you said, but for a different reason. A while back I misunderstood your involvement where you were advising a grandmother about her grandchild, and the grandchild had problems eating because his natural parents had forced him to eat feces when the child had been in their care. I actually wanted to apologize to you, and tell you that after posting my comments, I had to honestly and with an open mind "re-visit" my response to you. Mainly, I was puzzled why I felt so strongly that as a hypnotist we should not be involved ... I can safely say now, my reaction was one of over-reaction.

I am a retired peace officer who now has a hypnotherapy practice. During my career in law enforcement, I investigated countless numbers of child abuse and neglect cases, and have to admit each one sickened me with such disgust ... how could parents do those things to their own children? But what I discovered during my own review of my prior answer to you, was why I was feeling my reaction so strongly. It seems I have not actually dealt with my own emotions that were attached to having held witness to those crimes.

I still would stand by my original answer ... but not because as a hypnotist we should not help that child, but only because I see the liability attached to involvment in that particular case would be too risky, at least for me personally - namely the type of case you had explained in your post normally come with a long history of serious mental illness running in the family. I now feel a hypnotherapist who was skilled in those areas with children would be beneficial to that child.

Henxy said:

Hi Cathrine,

I suggest you keep well away from MH issues unless you're experienced/trained in the area and have the dr's permission. It's a very fragile area, and these patients (rather than clients) are particularly vulnerable.

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Permalink Reply by Susan French on November 10, 2009 at 5:49am

Hi Henxy and all,

I have learned to view most or all issues as having a physiological component and a "consciousness" component. I'm a big Bruce Lipton fan and follow all the new information about quantum healing and "energetics," a newish field that is evolving that points out that every thought we have elicits a physiological response which results in what we call "feeling" or emotion.

This field of thought, also called Energy Medicine and Energy Psychology suggests that every cell in our bodies and other people's bodies and possibly every bit of "space" that we call "space" or even vacuum are receivers and transmitters of little snippets of vibrating energy. This, I think, is the basis of "string theory" in physics or quantum physics. Bruce Lipton (Biology of Belief") suggests that it is the membrane of our cells that hold cellular memory as well as sending and receiving communication.

With that said, I therefore believe that we can help our cells, physical bodies (which includes our brain) and our "consciousness" fields/entities/whatever change and heal with new "thoughts," images or feelings. From that standpoint, I believe hypnosis can help because hypnosis helps us to concentrate these thoughts , images and "feelings."

I "talk to my body all the time to get pain to go away, to heal myself from the flu, to help with IBS syndromes and many other "physical" issues. I'm beginning to teach my clients to do the same.

From a Hypocratic Oath standpoint of "first do no harm", I can't imagine it being harmful to change our thoughts and attitudes.

Just my ideas about it. I also believe we have to be very careful about crossing lines into areas in which we are neither trained nor licensed.

Susant

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Permalink Reply by Jan Krüger on November 10, 2009 at 11:37am

Hi Vincent,

that was actually a wonderful opening you just gave me there.

It's true that physiology affects the mind. Everything else wouldn't make any sense. In fact, I think it's pretty much nonsensical to draw a distinction between mind and body and, even more so, brain and rest of body. The nervous system is spread all through the body, after all, and it just so happens that a lot of it resides in the brain, but I don't think it makes sense to simply ignore the rest of it.
I know my fair share about thyroid malfunctions; my mother had to have a large part of her thyroid removed a few years ago and mine isn't completely normal either.
Incidentally, I never claimed in my original post that physiology was irrelevant. I specifically said that it would be stupid to completely discount it.

And that's already part of why your reply is such a wonderful opening for me to take now: you found my post offensive for something that it didn't actually say! I really do understand your position, and it's precisely this position that keeps convincing me that mine is a very useful counterpoint to be aware of. I've got two reasons for that.

Reason number one is: the mind/body connection is not very well understood. Suppose many people with hypothyroidism are depressed. Can we conclude from that that hypothyroidism often causes depression? No, absolutely not! This is a fundamental mistake in reasoning that even a fair number of scientists make... despite what we know from statistics about the insidious similarity between correlation and causation.
There is probably some connection... but neither do we know how much of it is actually due to either the depression or the hypothyroidism, nor do we know which way the connection goes. For example: suppose hypothyroidism and depression reinforce each other, depending on the person's physiology...? This would be very, very hard to prove or disprove scientifically. And it would mean that changing either side of the coin might actually influence the other one, too.

Reason number two is: physiology doesn't, to my knowledge, override personal choice. Whew, that's a hard one... so let me talk about it independently of physiological things for now.

You said that my post was offensive. That statement raises many questions. Obviously, a post isn't alive or sentient, so it can hardly offend anyone. So, who offended whom here? Did I offend you? You could see it that way... even though until a few minutes ago I had no idea you existed, nor did I know anything about you, your beliefs, your situation or anything else. Considering that, you might concede that I didn't deliberately offend you... but that's actually way beside the point! The point I'm trying to make is that nobody on the planet can offend you if you don't let them offend you!

(This is the part where some people start getting offended again.)

So what am I saying? That you should ignore even the most grievous insults other people throw at you? No! But are you, in any way, obliged to feel bad about those insults? No again! You might stop associating with people who insult you, but why feel bad? It's absolutely legal to feel good for no reason at all, no matter the circumstances! Perhaps you think you don't have a choice. Whose choice is it, then? Your body's? Someone else's?

I don't know how much any given person's physiology affects that person's mood and feelings and thoughts. What I do know is that as long as that person assumes that physiology is responsible, they won't go looking for evidence to the contrary.

Perhaps hypothyroidism increases the risk of depression. Does that mean that you have to resign yourself to depression?

Whatever hand you're dealt, it's up to you what you do with it. Now, of course it's a bit simplistic to say that you could simply stop feeling bad. Many people are told something like that, then encouraged to "just feel better" or some such, and they don't know how to, nor how to find a way. No surprise there, especially when there is so much confusion about how "mental health" works in the first place!
I'd love to solve everyone's problems with just a few words... but I don't currently believe that there is an easy-to-follow generic recipe that works for everyone, and I think the principles that one could create an individual recipe from need a bit more of an explanation than I could fit into a forum post.

Yes, antidepressants have their uses. They also have a high chance of messing someone up in different ways, though, so even though careful design of a therapy plan that makes use of antidepressants is a valid way of going about things, I am not even remotely qualified in that field, nor do I want to be. My personal goal is to be able to help someone significantly change their life for the better in a single session. I can't currently consistently do that, but having this goal gives me a direction to go in... and that direction is about looking how people can change themselves, and not about how they can't.

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Permalink Reply by Don on November 10, 2009 at 12:58pm

Hi Folks,

The American Psychiatric Association does not attempt to define mental illness. Their Diagnnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-IV) lists over five hundred "disorders" which are the product a mass mulling of master minds extending over a period of many decades. They are the first to say that there are not so many separate mental "diseases," in the sense the measles, mumps, and chicken pox are separate physical diseases. Instead, they have come up with a set of diagnostic categories which may fit different individuals well or poorly, just as different suits of clothes off a rack may fit well or poorly until they have been individually tailored for a particular client. And just in case, there is usually a "wastebasket" category, such as delusional disorder NOS (not otherwise specified) or impulse control disorder NOS (not otherwise specified) for use when no amount of individual tailoring will suffice.

Hypnosis has a place in their treatment of many of these disorders. In addition to the Division of Psychological Hypnosis of the American Psychological Association, which Gil mentioned, there are also two "Establishment" organizations: the Society of Clinical and Experimetnal Hypnosis and the American Society of Clinical Hypnosis. The latter group will not admit you unless you have a license to practice in a recognized professional specialty (usually medicine, dentistry, or psychiatry) in the State in which you reside; and the former group is almost as stringent.

As far as the independent professional practice of hypnosis is concerned, I would urge you to not even attempt to work with serious mental disorders. By and large, psychiatrists do not attempt to deliver babies (although legally they can), and hypnotists should not attempt to deal with serious mental disorders such as schizoaffective disorder bipolar type (which legally they cannot). But there are plenty of other disorders which are not formally diagnosable in the DSM-IV, and more than enough to keep us all busy!

Don

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Permalink Reply by Robert Shanks on November 10, 2009 at 6:46pm

Hi Catherine,
I quite like Gil's reply, and I have heard similar cases to the one he mentioned.

I think the simplest answer is that it depends on the 'mental illness' involved. If the issue is mental, then hypnosis can help, if applied correctly. If the issue is physical (injury, chemical imbalance, etc.), then hypnosis may be the wrong tool for the job.

An analogy using a car may be that if the problem is with the driver, then changing the driver's habits can help. If the problem is that the steering is out, then the driver can only compensate so far.

Going back to Gil's post though, deal with the problem presented. Not the symptoms, or the issues that you want to look into, and you will get the best results. Not only that, you will get the respect of your client.

Robert

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Permalink Reply by Kelley Woods on November 11, 2009 at 8:13am

An interesting essay on subject of labels such as "mental illness": http://tinyurl.com/not-mentally-ill

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Permalink Reply by Don on November 11, 2009 at 1:23pm

Today's New York Times has an editorial entitled, "The Short Life of an Addiction," which deals with the inclusion and impending deletion of the diagnosis of Asperger's syndrome. The writer incisively discusses how it can come to pass that a "disease" can be created and then eliminated from the roster within the space of a few short years. I think we're all quite literally on the same page.

Here's the link:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/10/opinion/10baron-cohen.html?em

Don

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Permalink Reply by Michael Garner on December 13, 2009 at 3:12pm

In my opinion all mental illnesses are just differing degress of lack of control. If the person has brain damage from injury of birth of course thats diferent - but i,ve seen clients that have been sectioned in the past and medicated but they,ve all responded to therapy.
I,d never recommend therapy with someone not in contrl of themeselved to the degree that you,re not safe or cant build rapour but talking is therapy so why not trance.
I,d also make sure the individuals GP or health care practitioner gives permision for the therapy too.
After all most medicines create altered states and the pharmacy within us that we can all create naturally is far more powerfull once we,ve accessed it through thought.
Mike

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Permalink Reply by Ricky Strode on December 13, 2009 at 5:41pm

well if your brain can make a "mental illness" why wouldn't it be able to take it away ? If what doctors "are doing" isn't working, why do they keep doing it ? Its the way you approach it and the difference between them and ourselves that we need to really look and and come up with a way to make that possible. why couldn't you hypnotize people with " mental illnesses" they are already showing signs of hypnotic phemnomena

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