Can you be a successful hypnotist without NLP?

It seems to me, that hypnosis and NLP go hand and hand. However not all training provides the combination of the two. So my question is this, do any of you think your practice would be as successful if you had only trained in hypnosis, or only trained in NLP?

Regards,
Jen

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Permalink Reply by Omar Alexandro on February 9, 2012 at 9:52am

Hello, Jennifer. My understanding is that NLP is waaay more complex than hypnosis. In fact hypnosis is only one of the multiple tools in NLP. They are different things. NLP can make you practically a human lie detector. Or reading someone completely. Just like part of it is Covert hypnosis, and a lot more techniques.

Im looking to start studying NLP. I started a course and Im stuck since I need to be way more observative, which Im learning to do. Anyway, so far, I've been doing pretty good just with hypnosis without any NLP during my sessions.

I hope this helps to answer your question.

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Permalink Reply by Graham Old on February 9, 2012 at 10:03am

I think the real question should be, can an NLPer be successful without Hypnosis?

As it happens, I tend to see things completely the other way round to Omar.

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Permalink Reply by Donna Carter on February 9, 2012 at 10:05am

IMHO many people who have trained in hypnosis....have a great deal of NLP techniques incorporated even if someone didn't tell them it's there. So, the question then is ...should you be aware of using NLP while doing hypnosis...or unaware of the NLP techniques you use while doing hypnosis?

I am an advocate for being aware and learning the intricacies of both.

One thing that I have noticed, with myself and others, is that...what you are trained in isn't the key to success. The key to success is to actually utilize the knowledge you have - whatever that knowledge is.

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Permalink Reply by Barry Neale on February 9, 2012 at 10:13am

These answer to your question "do any of you think your practice would be as successful if you had only trained in hypnosis, or only trained in NLP? " Is yes.

As a trainer of NLP and hypnosis there is no question in my mind that you can be successful with "just" hypnosis and the same way you can be successful with "just" NLP

People like Jerry Kein and Cal Banyan have been very successful with hypnotherapy and their processes are "pure" hypnosis. Not an NLP technique in sight.

And their are many NLPers who are very successful and yet they couldn't hypnotise themselves out of a wet paper bag.

Although as I said I am an NLP trainer I have to tell you there is a lot of BS talked about it. Most of the BS comes from marketers selling "covert hypnosis" programs, and sorry Omar but it won't turn you into a human lie detector. Yes you can learn to have much better sensory acuity and pick up things that you never knew were there but it is not like you see in Hollywood. I watched an episode of NCIS recently and in an interrogation scene and the guy looked up to his right and the detective said, "He's lying cos his eyes looked up" Phhhooooeeyyy.

NLP is a great thing to learn but it is not necessary to be successful at helping people make changes IF you get good quality hypnosis training.

barry

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Permalink Reply by Omar Alexandro on February 9, 2012 at 10:40am

Hello, Barry. you just made me know that the NLP book I got is crap Lol.

Thay talk a lot about Milton Erickson saying how he was feared by every nurse because he would know who dated whom the night before or which nurse did what the night before just by looking at them. And he would know everything just by looking at them.

I need to study more about this guy, but at least this is what they say in the book I got. And would love to learn NLP plus ericksonian hypnosis. I've only used classic hypnosis so far.

The key is never finish learning :)

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Permalink Reply by Barry Neale on February 9, 2012 at 11:05am

HI Omar,

You can do incredible things with sensory acuity but what is taught in the average NLP training is not going to turn you into a human lie detector.

As good as Erickson was there is a lot of mythology about him. Yes he had incredible sensory acuity but the NLP world has made him into a god and some of the stories come from people who never even met him. Even Bandler and Grinder only met him a couple of times

If you are interested in micro expressions you might want to check out the work of Paul Ekman PhD. He is the inspiration of the tv series Lie to Me. His work is really interesting.

I agree the key is to never finish learning and one of your greatest teachers are going to be your clients

have fun

barry

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Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on February 9, 2012 at 11:26am

Hi Jen,

I truly believe that I am a better practitioner because I studied hypnosis and NLP.

@ Barry,

As you say - many have distinguished themselves soley as hypnotists or NLPers, but that does not mean they would not have been even more "effective" and/or "successful" if they had added hypnosis or NLP to their exsiting practice.

Are you not a better practitioner because you have mastered both arts? Do you think that becoming a better practitioner added to the development of your practice?

@ Omar-

My understanding is that sooner or later, just about every one who studies covert hypnosis and/or NLP with the intent to seduce or manipulate quickly discovers they have wasted their money.

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Permalink Reply by Barry Neale on February 9, 2012 at 11:48am

HI Michael,

I certainly think I am a better practitioner because I have studied both fields I was merely pointing out that to run a successful practice you don't need to know NLP.

I think a lot of success comes from the belief and expectancy of the therapist and i believe that one of the reasons people like Kein, Banyan etc are so successful it that they use something that works for them and they are so congruent with that process that their clients pick up on this at some level and change.

Sometimes a different way of doing something creates doubt within the practitioner and their success rates drop

I know Steve Parkhill who has incredible success with some "heavy duty" problems has said that when he started adding NLP he saw his success rates drop. Was it the NLP or was it his incongruence with the technique. i would suggest it is the later.

could they be more successful? Maybe. I know that Kein/Banyan etc have been exposed to NLP (Jerry promotes Wil Horton) and yet for some reason they stick to what they know and are very successful at it.

Personally I like having a big tool box. So on top of the NLP hypnosis I have studied CBT, EMDR, EFT, TFT, SI and half a dozen other acronyms and a couple of degrees in psychology. I'd like to think they all help me be the therapist I am today (although I am not sure about the degrees!)

best wishes

barry

Michael Ellner said:

Hi Jen,

I truly believe that I am a better practitioner because I studied hypnosis and NLP.

@ Barry,

As you say - many have distinguished themselves soley as hypnotists or NLPers, but that does not mean they would not have been even more "effective" and/or "successful" if they had added hypnosis or NLP to their exsiting practice.

Are you not a better practitioner because you have mastered both arts? Do you think that becoming a better practitioner added to the development of your practice?

@ Omar-

Think of NLP as hypnosis without conventional entrancement -- My understanding is that sooner or latter, just about every one who studies covert hypnosis and/or NLP with the intent to seduce or manipulate quickly discovers they have wasted their money.

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Permalink Reply by Omar Alexandro on February 9, 2012 at 12:23pm

I am honestly interested in every field. I do think the more tools you get the chances are bigger. There was a therapist telling me he started getting way more clients when he stopped calling himself a hypnotherapist and calling him an "Imagery guided practitioner". Inducing trance with the eyes open without any formal induction. People are not afraid of letting go.

Tony Kamo (One of the most known hypnotists in Mexico even though he's spanish), ive seen him doing anesthesia without a formal induction, in fact, it took him a very little time. (I have no idea how he did it).

I honestly am not that interested in becoming a lie detector. Lol. I think I miss-guided my point lol. But, NLP is my next step on what I want to learn. I've seen very interesting things. I do believe in certain points of what NLP stands for. For example, My very own way of thinking is not visual, hearing, or even kinesthesic. Every single thought I have are in words. Everything is like a conversation with myself. (Probably that has kept me from my imagination exercises in selfhypnosis).

Im loosing my point. My point is, the more tools you get, it "Should" be better.

Is my very personal believe.

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Permalink Reply by Don on February 9, 2012 at 12:24pm

Jeff,

To the best of my knowledge,no psychologists or psychiatrists have been trained in NLP in medical school or in graduate school, or in workshops sponsored by the American Association of Clinical Hypnosis or the Society for Clinical and Experimental Hypnosis. I can find no references to NLP in in our data base of psychological literature, and I have found no references to NLP in the indexes of major textbooks on hypnosis written by any academic authors. I therefore believe that the answer to your question is yes, because most of the psychologists and psychiatrists who use hypnosis in their practices are successful. Hypnosis has certainly served me well in my current practice, and I use it several times a day.

It is not generally known that one of the functions of University teaching faculties is to answer questions from the general public. I suggest that you telephone the psychology department of the nearest University where graduate courses in psychology are offered, and ask to speak to the professor who teaches courses in hypnosis. Ask him or her the same question you are asking here. And in case the response should surprise you, perhaps you could also ask for an explanation.

Don

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Permalink Reply by Bill Kennedy on February 9, 2012 at 12:33pm

It's a false dichotomy. Both are modalities designed to do the same thing with a large overlap. Study all the techniques that you can and don't worry where one stops and the next starts. After some experience, most practitioners use an eclectic blend of different approaches. Very few are "pure" practitioners of this or that school.

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Permalink Reply by Don on February 9, 2012 at 12:56pm

Bill,

Sounds good to me.

Don

Bill Kennedy said:

It's a false dichotomy. Both are modalities designed to do the same thing with a large overlap. Study all the techniques that you can and don't worry where one stops and the next starts. After some experience, most practitioners use an eclectic blend of different approaches. Very few are "pure" practitioners of this or that school.