Hypnosis While Asleep

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Permalink Reply by Dee Twentyman on November 29, 2008 at 8:19am

Hello Bonnie,
This is an interesting question and one where there will be a variety of responses however i would say yes you can hypnotise someone while they sleep. The subconscious mind has a job, and that is to protect us, if the subconscious mind switched itself off while we slept then it stands to reason that all the things it is responsible for, e.g. breathing, swallowing, circulation, brain activity, among all the other subconscious functions of our bodies would also shut down and we would die. Our subconscious mind never sleeps that is why we dream, it is also why we can sleep through a thunderstorm, yet if our child wimpers three doors down we are awake and we respond to it. A person does not need to consciously hear the words, the voice is heard but not always the individual words that are spoken, think of subliminal messages and you will get what i mean. Therefore it stands to reason that if you play a hypnotic CD the subconscious mind will accept the suggestions on there just as if they are in your therapy room. Many clients comment that they do not know how the treatment worked when they didnt physically 'hear' the words and yet they recover from their symptoms just as well as those who do hear every word. I would be interested to hear what others on this group think.

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Permalink Reply by Lee Darrow on November 29, 2008 at 1:36pm

One key point is consent - informed consent obviously, from the subject, prior to the attempt. Ethically, that makes all the difference in the world. With permission, it's all good, so long as the hypnotist sticks to the agreed-upon agenda. Without permission, there are some serious ethical questions that could be raised about such an attempt... not that I expect anyone here to go that route, of course - my statements are for the general public who may read this site and draw some possibly incorrect conclusions...

Secondly, hypnosis from the sleep state is actually a conversion process - converting sleep to a partial wakened state which is then pulled through to hypnosis. The toughest part, usually, is for the hypnotist to stay awake long enough to accomplish the attempt... the second toughest is not to fully wake the subject.

Lastly, hypnosis conversion from sleep often winds up with full amnesia for trance events, but not always. Be aware of this when working with someone - they could recall all that you do or recall nothing (and try to blame you for trying to collect your fee when they believe that you have done nothing).

Just some comments from the sidelines...

Lee Darrow, C.H.
"The Stage Hypnosis Safety Guy"

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Permalink Reply by Rich Wilson on November 29, 2008 at 2:14pm

How to Hypnotize a Sleeping Person
This method is ideal for hypnotizing a sleeping partner or child.

On entering the room where your sleeping subject is, you will need to establish a rapport with them. You can do this by sitting quietly by their bedside and watching their breathing. By matching your own breathing to that of your subject for a few minutes they will become receptive to you on an unconscious level.

Gradually, change your own breathing by deliberately slowing it down - your subject should soon follow suit - don't worry if it doesn't happen instantly - they will eventually follow.

The next stage is to gently stroke one of your subject's fingers - keeping this in time with your breathing. Avoid any abrupt movements as this will disturb your subject - after a few minutes you can commence by saying (softly) the person's name, followed by:
This is your mother/father (or whatever your relationship to the subject is) here - you can hear me - but you won't wake up - you can hear me but you won't wake up.
Repeat this sentence several times. Your subject may move but even if they verbally respond at this stage it is unlikely that they are awake.

Follow this through with:
When the very deepest part of your mind is listening to me - you can let me know by moving this (index or whichever) finger - and you can still hear me - but you won't wake up.
Again, you may need to do this several times. Milton Erickson used this method with his son after he was involved in a road crash and I believe it took him several nights to achieve bringing him out of sleep and into hypnosis so do persevere.

When you get the response you're looking for, you can continue with suggestions such as:
You can talk, but you won't wake up. The very deepest part of your mind knows what your problem is and can help us to find the solution.

Or - you can give direct suggestions for whatever you're trying to achieve. But - remember - this must always be something that is in the subject's best interests - because even in this level of somnambulist hypnosis they will not take on board suggestions that are against their own moral judgement.

Note - when Erickson used this method his son was experiencing very bad nightmares after his accident.

Erickson verified what had happened and reframed it. He described the accident and told his son - yes - it did happen - but you survived. He could not deny the accident and knew that his son knew that it had happened and - even in hypnosis - would not believe him if he had said that it never happened.
When you've finished with therapy you can give the subject suggestions to return to a peaceful sleep, having beautiful dreams, and awaken at their usual waking up time, feeling refreshed and alert.

One, two, three, four, five.

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Permalink Reply by Fable Goodman on November 29, 2008 at 2:47pm

I have some ethical questions, about interfering with anyone while they are sleeping.

Certainly I would want there to be clear and informed consent beforehand that this was what the person wanted.

I just noticed whilst typing this that lee has also expressed similar reservations, and indeed has said almost exactly what I was going to say.


As Lee said, you are in effect gently waking the person up to go into hypnosis.

I think it is better left to a time when both parties are fully awake. Not only will it be more effective, is is much more free from possible misunderstandings.

In the case of someone snoring, This is not usually a problem for them. It is usually someone else that has a problem with this. That other person is the one who usually would benefit form suggestions for sleeping better, regardless of how much their bed partner snores.

As children are not really in a position to give informed consent, I would definately stay clear from that area.

Love and hugs,

Fable

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Permalink Reply by Bonnie Robinson on November 29, 2008 at 4:09pm

I definitely agree it would have to be with consent. The reason I asked was partially because my husband who does snore, when I woke him up by asking him to turn over he said, well maybe you can just hypnotize me not to snore (grin) and it got me to thinking, hmmmm wonder if that is actually possible.

Then I got to thinking for those people that can never "find the time" to listen to the reinforcement CD's that you send home with them if perhaps you could send one home with them that they could listen to the one time of the day when they aren't doing 10 other things, while they are asleep. I do understand that many will say if they aren't willing to put in the time etc but I wonder if this could be another alternative.

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Permalink Reply by Melissa J. Roth on December 2, 2008 at 7:35am

My practice is focused predominantly on physical healing. I always instruct my clients listen to the CD of their session as they are going to sleep at night? Why? Most of them don't have the time during the day but mainly because whatever is the last thing they are thinking before dropping into sleep is going to be "re-played" through the unconscious mind all night. I partially attribute my high success rates to them listening while sleeping. The clients who do play their CD's at some other time do not get the same levels of success as those who play them while sleeping.

Several years ago, my daughter was failing second grade in spite of having an IQ in the upper Superior range. She was failing because she didn't want to do the work--plain and simple. So, for 30 nights in a row I would slip into her bedroom after she was asleep, establish rapport by using the breathing technique described above and would give her the suggestion that she would develop an insatiable curiosity that would only be fulfilled by learning, that she would enjoy learning and would do so at a rapid pace so that she could have time to enjoy playing, etc. Her teacher caught me in the carpool line one day near the end of term and told me that she had never seen the kind of 90 degree turnaround as my daughter had exhibited. She said she had been a teacher for 26 years and would have sworn that no child could make up an entire year's work in 30 days--that it wasn't possible--until she witnessed my daughter doing it and then going forward to the top of the class. She was astonished. I never admitted to either of them what I had done. My daughter went on to enter college at 15--because her curiosity led her there. Now that she seems to be making a career out of college I think I need to implant suggestions that she can continue to learn in an environment that pays her instead of costing me tuition money.

That said, between adults I think it should be consenul.

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Permalink Reply by Fable Goodman on December 2, 2008 at 9:07am

As I said in an earlier post: "I have some ethical questions, about interfering with anyone while they are sleeping.

Certainly I would want there to be clear and informed consent beforehand that this was what the person wanted."

"As children are not really in a position to give informed consent, I would definately stay clear from that area."

I find your last sentence a little puzzling melissa. Adults deserve the respect of not being hypnotised and treated without consent... But a child does not have the same rights?

I wonder why you have never "admitted" to her what you had done.

How do you imagine she would react if you had told her?

I am glad she went to college and seems to be dong well.


Love and hugs,

Fable

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Permalink Reply by Lee Darrow on December 2, 2008 at 6:23pm

Many parents talk to their kids when they are asleep. The difference between them and a hypnotist is that the hypnotist does it better!

In the case of a parent giving motivational suggestions to their sleeping child to help them in school, I see no ethical issue in that, whatsoever. That is a parent doing what a parent is supposed to do - motivate their child to achieve to the best of their ability. The example Melissa gives is a clear example of parenting augmented by hypnosis.

Sometimes, as several of my instructors in therapy have told me, the client actually does not consciously want what is obviously best for them, in this case, achieving better grades in school, which results in getting into a better college and generally results in better employability, etc....

It beats the heck out of the alternative K.I.T.A. Therapy - that's Kick In The Assets for those of you not familiar with the term!

However, using it for something that's not so clear-cut as the above example does, indeed bring into question the ethics of the process and raises the need for informed consent....

My thanks to those who said nice things about my earlier post, they are deeply appreciated, too...

Lee Darrow, C.H.
"The Stage Hypnosis Safety Guy"

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