I Tawt I Taw A Putty Tat

I just got a call from someone who talked like tweet bird.

I am thinking of suggestions to grow up is ok (Elman),

Change submodalities of feelings associated with speech impediment,

Increase awareness of parts of body and how they are used in producing speech.

Practice years of speaking correctly (time distortion)

Deep Trance Identification of a known, skilled orator (Cunningham)

This is just the 1st session.

Any other suggestions?

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Permalink Reply by Richard Nongard - NLPBoard.com on July 20, 2011 at 5:44pm

I see it has resolved.

Often people confuse LAW, ETHICS and MORALS.

Someday, I will expand on this, I am out of time right now also.

That being said, I am glad Vince has posted his response to this, and knowing Vince, am sure he is interested in being the best hypnotist/nlp peson possible. For all of us, that means changing our viewpoints form time to time. I have occasionally learned about ethics the hard way, or even morals and law....

Fortunaly Vince learned the easy way, on hypnothoughts and discussion rather than by experiencing consequences.

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Permalink Reply by Fable Goodman on July 21, 2011 at 1:46am

Vince said: "It seems that we have different ethics.

I try not to judge any of you. You're all free to have your own opinions too. That's why it's great to have a forum like hypnothoughts."

Richard hinted: "judge not lest thou be judged" And "why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?" (I paraphrase!)

This thread seem to be inviting/challenging us all to examine our own personal/professional code of ethics/morals/practice.

I certainly have my own code of ethics, which is similar to many other's in certain key ways, and quite different from many in other ways. It is tailored to fit my multidisciplinary approach, my own personal beliefs and values, and allows a certain amount of flexibility. A 'one size fits all' code of ethics would not work at all for me.

If anyone was to ask me to write down my code of ethics I would have to put a lot of thought into it. Although many aspects which are fundamental, would be the same or similar to many hypnotherapy/psychotherapy/counselling organisations... Most of my personal code of ethics is in my head, and has never been clearly or explicitly defined..

Who else is enjoying this opportunity to to a little self examination, and re evaluation of their personal code?

Love and hugs,

Lawrie Shaw

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Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on July 21, 2011 at 2:16am

I am very open to learning and growing and I am open to self-examination

FYI - Certified hypnosis practitioners in the US are certified by Hypnosis Organizations that have rules of conduct for the members they certify -- These rules of professional conduct are called ethics - The agreement is if you want certification you agree to that organizations standards for professional behavior.

Fable Goodman said:

Vince said: "It seems that we have different ethics.

I try not to judge any of you. You're all free to have your own opinions too. That's why it's great to have a forum like hypnothoughts."

Richard hinted: "judge not lest thou be judged" And "why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?" (I paraphrase!)

This thread seem to be inviting/challenging us all to examine our own personal/professional code of ethics/morals/practice.

I certainly have my own code of ethics, which is similar to many other's in certain key ways, and quite different from many in other ways. It is tailored to fit my multidisciplinary approach, my own personal beliefs and values, and allows a certain amount of flexibility. A 'one size fits all' code of ethics would not work at all for me.

If anyone was to ask me to write down my code of ethics I would have to put a lot of thought into it. Although many aspects which are fundamental, would be the same or similar to many hypnotherapy/psychotherapy/counselling organisations... Most of my personal code of ethics is in my head, and has never been clearly or explicitly defined..

Who else is enjoying this opportunity to to a little self examination, and re evaluation of their personal code?

Love and hugs,

Lawrie Shaw

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Permalink Reply by Lisa on July 22, 2011 at 7:07am

Thank you Kelley, Michael, Scott, Richard, Vince, Jackie, Steve, Tc, Fable, Nathan, Keithanthony, Giselle, and everyone,

When I first saw this discussion it had maybe 1-2 replies at that time about working with a speech impediment (?) and I assumed the client had come to Vince asking for help with it. I skipped it for days and just today noticed it had almost 40 replies. Thought that was a bit unusual for something about speech impediment work. Just popped in out of curiosity and read the entire thread. You all saved me from making a very serious ethical mistake. Scott's example of the surgeon's surprise bonus breast augmentation hit home. It made me think about how I'd feel if I awoke from surgery for an appendectomy and discovered I'd been "gifted" with dueling 48DD's. It hit me like a bolt of lightening.

While I am not certified yet-I am a student-I still must adhere to to the ethical standards of the profession I wish to be part of. Please, if anyone ever sees me post anything publicly or privately that might even skirt close to an ethical issue-tell me immediately publicly or privately. Don't assume I know better or that I will figure it out on my own before I try it.

I was considering "fixing" a friend's anger and rigidity issues. Without asking her first and surely without being asked until I read this thread. Not only would it have been ethically wrong-I could have risked unanticipated and unpredictable consequences to her. I will never consider doing anything ever again without a person's consent, knowledge, and direct request.

Thank you all for opening my eyes. Thank goodness for HypnoThoughts.com and all of you.

gentle day,

Lisa

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Permalink Reply by H Larry Elman on July 23, 2011 at 3:12pm

Vince --

You've sort of jumped the gun. Did you first establish whether it was really Tweety Bird or not?

Larry

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Permalink Reply by H Larry Elman on July 23, 2011 at 3:43pm

Hey Guys --

I've been skipping many of the more long-winded replies (on both sides), so what I have to say (besides the humor I posted a few minutes ago) may be very redundant and already covered.

My advice to Age Regressionists meeting a PLR unexpectedly is to follow the client while staying on the problem -- do not get tempted to explore the 12th Century out of curiousity. I believe that can be generalized to one of the positions just already stated -- you were hired for Problem X and that is your professional responsibility.

But we have all encountered inter-twined problems. For example, a client comes in with fibermyalgea (please excuse the spelling), wanting pain control. You discover the client's pain is worse when upset or when under stress, Clearly, treating the stress factor will go a long way to handling the pain. What do you do? Too many postings take too rigid a view of this problem. Me? I'd attempt to get the client to understand how the two interact, and then get permission to work on both. But I can imagine cases where one has to work with both problems with less-than-explicit commitment by the client. Can't someone discuss HOW to do that without becoming emotional and overly adamant for a single ethical position? I seem to detect a lynch-mob atmosphere (on both sides). A forum like this should seek solutions rather than castigate one with a different view.

It is my belief that when a problem can be handled in trance with superficial suggestion it is unlikely to fit into the situations I've just described. However, as soon as it requires hypno-analysis / regression, it is likely to be multi-faceted and require one to carefully define objectives. Some of the purist positions taken here would make those tools inadmissible.

Could we please lower the adamant screaming volume of the discussion and start examining HOW to handle complex situations. And don't start questioning my ethics for simply advocating this or you might find I have a sharp tongue and a short temper......which would fit in quite well with the vituperation of some comments here.

H Larry Elman

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Permalink Reply by Fable Goodman on July 24, 2011 at 4:10am

Larry,

I think we must have been reading different threads.

I am wondering if your perception of the tone of this thread,

perhaps says more about they way you have read it than what has been said.

admitedly, you did say, you skipped many of the replies.

I did not pick up on the vituperation that you perceive.

Maybe I'll have to read the whole thread again from begining to end,

with a more open minded attitude.

vituperation - abusive or venomous language used to express blame or censure or bitter deep-seated ill will.

Love and hugs,

Lawrie Shaw

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Permalink Reply by Susan French on July 24, 2011 at 1:12pm

My first suggestion: approach this client with the utmost of respect and desire to be of service to him. If you can't get that feeling, do him a favor and refer him out.

My second suggestion: be certain that this person doesn't have a speech impediment.

My third comment is actually a question: I didn't notice the presenting issue. IS the presenting issue that he doesn't like his voice?

I don't mean to be snarky but I'd take a really good look at my own feelings towards this client. If those feelings are not completely coming from a place of wanting to help, find someone who can.

Susan

http://www.hypno4success.com

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Permalink Reply by H Larry Elman on July 24, 2011 at 7:29pm

Fable/Lawrie --

I initially took this thread as humorous -- see my short posting immediately above my longer one.

When I hit the absolutist debates on ethics I was surprised to see them on a humorous thread. If they were meant jokingly, they certainly did not sound so.

I believe strongly in the importance of ethics and high standards. There are places of I-do-not-see-any-exceptions. For me, such might be hitting a rape incident during a regression. I would take the client away from that fast. If the rape were an ISE, knowing it happened is all I need to know -- I don't need gory details. If the rape is not connected with the therapy, I am intruding. Either way, BACK OFF FAST. Also, in such a case, one must ask whether a hypnotherapist is the correct choice; whether you have a reporting responsibility; whether..... So, just get out and ponder the questions later.

But most items we hypnotherapists deal with are much more mundane. Thus, most are "judgement calls." Placing a rigid lock on ethics in a judgement call area seems silly to me. That view, plus what appeared to me to be pretty strong anger are what triggered my posting. If you feel I over-reacted, sorry. But please note the juxtaposition of clearly humorous responses with ones appearing deadly serious.

I have now beaten this to death, but I would be interested in your view after considering my confusion over whether the angrier postings were intended to be humorous. Looking forward to your views.

Larry

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Permalink Reply by Stephanie Conkle on July 25, 2011 at 7:05am

I agree that this discussion should be featured. This is the first thread in a long time that I actually took the time to read each and every post and took time to reflect on my own practices.

There have been times when someone has come in for something else (i.e. weight loss, smoking) and a deeper issue came out in hypnosis that we worked on in tandem with the presenting issue. I would say most of my clients have several issues, all intertwined. As long as the client brings it up and is willing to talk to me about it, I take that as permission and roll with it organically. Of course, I always begin with the presenting issue and let whatever develops from there just happen naturally, according to what wells up in the client's subconscious.

I think if Vince C. would start with the "mundane" problem and work from there, it will act as a spring board into deeper issues. What we think of as mundane, may be the client masking something deeper. The speech impediment may come up via the client herself. If not, I wouldn't bring it up.

(Or you could directly, and gently, ask her in the office interview how long she has had a speech impediment and if she would like to work on that in hypnotherapy. She might slap you and walk out, or she might be grateful that you brought it up, being embarrassed to ask herself, and agree to it. That way, it gets permission up front.)

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Permalink Reply by Kathleen Hanover on July 25, 2011 at 7:38am

Perspective is so interesting...I recognized that Vince C. was trying to be funny when he posted the Tweetie Bird cartoon, but as soon as he announced that he wasn't going to allow "ethics" to get in the way of his using a client to get his needs met, I think subsequent commenters took the issues discussed very seriously. (I'm very happy that Vince rethought his position as a result of others' comments, and I applaud his maturity.)

Over the past few days, several threads on HypnoThoughts--including this one--have inspired me to do a lot of thinking around the topic of ethics and the client/therapist relationship. There are real-world reasons why ethics and integrity are important to the success of hypnotherapy (and any other kind of therapy, I suspect). Ethics aren't just "nice to have," they impact your effectiveness as a therapist. They impact your reputation, and can ultimately impact your ability to make a living in this field. Lack of ethics can even land you in jail, depending on your local regulations.

I've posted a discussion in Michael Ellner's "Safe Place" group that discusses the ethics of using social media like Facebook to recruit..., and how I've come to believe that it's a really bad idea (despite the fact that I'm a marketer by trade.) Discussions like this one, and Scott's post about Facebook, set the client side of my brain at war with the marketer and PR side of my brain, and no one was more surprised than I that the client side won out.

Congratulations, again, to Vince C. for recognizing room for improvement, and then improving.

H Larry Elman said:

Fable/Lawrie --

I initially took this thread as humorous -- see my short posting immediately above my longer one.

When I hit the absolutist debates on ethics I was surprised to see them on a humorous thread. If they were meant jokingly, they certainly did not sound so.

I believe strongly in the importance of ethics and high standards. There are places of I-do-not-see-any-exceptions. For me, such might be hitting a rape incident during a regression. I would take the client away from that fast. If the rape were an ISE, knowing it happened is all I need to know -- I don't need gory details. If the rape is not connected with the therapy, I am intruding. Either way, BACK OFF FAST. Also, in such a case, one must ask whether a hypnotherapist is the correct choice; whether you have a reporting responsibility; whether..... So, just get out and ponder the questions later.

But most items we hypnotherapists deal with are much more mundane. Thus, most are "judgement calls." Placing a rigid lock on ethics in a judgement call area seems silly to me. That view, plus what appeared to me to be pretty strong anger are what triggered my posting. If you feel I over-reacted, sorry. But please note the juxtaposition of clearly humorous responses with ones appearing deadly serious.

I have now beaten this to death, but I would be interested in your view after considering my confusion over whether the angrier postings were intended to be humorous. Looking forward to your views.

Larry

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Permalink Reply by Lisa on July 26, 2011 at 5:28pm

I apologize to Michael Ellner. I should have brought up my concerns to him privately rather than publicly here in a ridiculously long diatribe. There are no excuses for my lapse in judgement and it will not happen again. These sorts of things need to be very short if they must be public at all and not the complete overkill I indulged in. Everyone deserves the same amount of respect and consideration regardless of their level and experience. I failed miserably in this and I am very sorry. I violated the very thing I was talking about. When there are concerns about someones behavior it should be handled much more skillfully and delicately that what I did. It should be brought up privately as you pointed out to me.

Michael, I apologize to you for my poor behavior and bad judgement in my handling of this.

If you choose to de-friend me over this I could not blame you and would respect your choice.

gentle day,

Lisa