Possible Talking Point: Can Positive Affirmations Have Negative Effects?

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Permalink Reply by Susan French on July 5, 2009 at 11:29am

I agree Fable. In the Hick's Abraham books (which are not psychology or hypnosis but metaphysics) they make the point that you usually can't make a huge jump in feelings or belief. I think their points are useful here. I believe in David Dawkins "Power vs Force" (an amazingly interesting book), he also talks about moving "state" up in increments.

For instance, if you're deeply depressed and on the verge of apathy, you wouldnt exactly move to ecstatically happy. They (and Dawkins) have an emotion scale in which they ascribe ascending numbers from the very lowest emotional state to the very highest. I can't remember how many they use, but it's close to 20 I think.

So apathy wouldn't move to joy. I think I gave away the book that had the ascending emotions in it but here is something similar by Dawkins:

If the lowest emotion was shame, the next one up would be guilt, then up to apathy, to grief, to fear, to desire,
to anger, to pride, to courage, to neutrality, to willingness, to acceptance to reason, to love, to joy, to peace to enlightenment.

In fact, silly as it might sound on the surface, when I started working on that in myself (about 30ish years ago), I found a decent starting point to be "I'm just as good as everyone or anyone else, if not better. I'm just as worthy, just as loveable as anyone else."

From there it always seems easier when you can get the client to neutral, if that makes any sense.

Susan

Fable Goodman said:

one needs to make the affirmation, at a level that is acceptable to, and workabvle with the person at that time..
For some, this may be..." At least I am not the worst piece of garbage I have ever come across".
that is a step in the right direction for some people.

When some one has very low self esteem, you need to first of all meet them where they are, and give them a set of suggestions, (or affirmations) that are just enough to challenge them and move them forward, without provoking the patterns that say otherwise.. LIttle by little, you can increase the positive affirmations, at the pace that the client can live with, and work with.

Many peope like to work far more quickly than their clients are able to cope with, and convince themselves that they are doing an excelllent job.

Slow down, and work with the client, rather than trying to push the client to work at your pace., and much more rapid progress will be made.

Love and hugs.

Fable

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Permalink Reply by Michael Haifleigh on July 5, 2009 at 1:08pm

Susan,

That's a wonderfully elegant way of saying that, thank you.

Michael Haifleigh

Susan French said:

...it always seems easier when you can get the client to neutral, if that makes any sense.

Susan

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Permalink Reply by James Malone on July 5, 2009 at 3:32pm

Dan, thanks for that idea, its a definite keeper! Jim

Dan Paris said:

Hi Michael Haifleigh,

Since you enjoyed my reply on the IMDHA board and even more especially since you were saddened to hear about the recent death of Billy Mays I'll post my thoughts here again.

But first, I spent the day at the San Diego County Fair today and paused in the exhibition hall where Billy Mays worked about 7-10 years ago and I really began to appreciate the skill that goes in to the demonstrations these men and women make. The best, as was Billy, are truly hypnotic. I've watched about an hour or so worth of Billy's work today on youtube and like you am sad for the loss.

Here is my reply to the question at hand:

I love the thought that as we craft a specific affirmation or suggestion, one that our client has asked for, we offer an outcome different than was found by giving a subject in a study a generic, un-elicited affirmation like "I am loveable."

A mentor taught me to reduce dissonance and write affirmations differently for things we want but don't yet believe.

He suggested, when this is happening to simply add the softener "I love the thought" in front of the affirmation. This is especially useful when the affirmation is at the identity level as they did in the study.

This way if the person is not feeling completely loveable when they say, "I am lovable," they can instead say, "I love the thought that I am lovable," and now more easily accept the suggestion.

As hypnotists we can further use this idea to craft suggestions like, "you can fall in love with the idea that you are lovable" or "you may begin to notice yourself falling in love with the thought that you are lovable."


Dan Paris





Michael Haifleigh said:

Michael,

Thanks for pointing out the article and issue. I think the issue is worthy of inquiry and research, whether the focus is self help books in general or affirmations in particular.

This particular article does not seem to do the studies justice. It would be great if it were a matter of a few mouse clicks and $19.95 to obtain a copy of the studies.

BTW: I was surprised and saddened to hear of the recent death of Infomercial King, Billy Mays.

Michael Haifleigh

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Permalink Reply by Bren B on July 6, 2009 at 8:51pm

I'm not a practitioner...I'm more like one of the low-self-esteemers. As such, I agree that making statements about myself that I know are not true could heighten my sense of contrast with what I would like to be like, but am not.

I've met some people with morbidly low self-esteem such that it is a personality disorder. Is there a place for helping a person through hypnosis, in a sense, create an alternate "self" and then building up that alternate that is not bound by all the restrictions and negativity of the primary self? The person might be so conflicted and bound in their primary self that they just could not even entertain positive suggestions about themselves. But, if they were given a "safe self" that was unrestricted and that they could experiment with, and they were empowered to observe their "alternate" self to see how that self would respond to positive suggestions, sort of like creating an "avatar" version of themselves, then they can positively affirm their avatar version. Then the task could be to give the person permission to incorporate into their "real" self the positive effects their affirmations were having on their unrestricted avatar. Just a thought...what do you think?

Bren

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Permalink Reply by Susan French on July 7, 2009 at 8:36am

Hi Bren,

I think what we often forget is that healing (emotional or physical) occurs kind of like the peeling of an onion (perhaps backwards, from peeled to whole...lol).

I've always experienced these kinds of really deep-seated self-worth issues as being resolved incrementally. You have to begin to see that your belief about yourself may not be accurate. Then you live with it a little while, (or perhaps "chew on it" would be a better way to put it). You begin to incorporate that idea, noticing in your life how it applies. I had a psychiatrist-therapist once who used to say "Insight alone is not enough." It took me awhile before I understood what he meant.

Then you begin to think about an alternate belief that might be more accurate, and you chew on that.. Then you might begin to be able to accept that you really ARE more valuable and lovable than you previously thought...and you chew on that, etc. and on up the scale to self-acceptance.

Sometimes you can take a shortcut and, in hypnosis, have the client feel, visualize, imagine, experience a state of self-acceptance and self-love through visualization and future pacing. Even if you get only a glimmer of that state, once you've seen it and felt it, it becomes easier to reach even without all of the "understanding and incorporating."

Repeating what everyone else seems to be saying, a more positive state is usually reached in increments that are believable and acceptable to the client in his present state of mind.

Susan

Bren B said:

I'm not a practitioner...I'm more like one of the low-self-esteemers. As such, I agree that making statements about myself that I know are not true could heighten my sense of contrast with what I would like to be like, but am not.
I've met some people with morbidly low self-esteem such that it is a personality disorder. Is there a place for helping a person through hypnosis, in a sense, create an alternate "self" and then building up that alternate that is not bound by all the restrictions and negativity of the primary self? The person might be so conflicted and bound in their primary self that they just could not even entertain positive suggestions about themselves. But, if they were given a "safe self" that was unrestricted and that they could experiment with, and they were empowered to observe their "alternate" self to see how that self would respond to positive suggestions, sort of like creating an "avatar" version of themselves, then they can positively affirm their avatar version. Then the task could be to give the person permission to incorporate into their "real" self the positive effects their affirmations were having on their unrestricted avatar. Just a thought...what do you think?
Bren

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Permalink Reply by Fable Goodman on July 7, 2009 at 9:08am

I agree thoroughly with Susan.

Fundamental changes, are usually worked on incrementally.

There is a widespread myth that hypnosis short cuts that process.

I am sure it does, but only to some degree. One still needs to work at the pace that the client can assimilate, and integrate the changes in their life. Also the clients friends and aquainatances, will have reactions to any change, (the ripple effect) and the client needs to be able to assimilate their reactions and still keep moving forward at a pace that fits both themself and their contacts.

Big rapid changes are not easdy to live with.

I am all in favour of sloow, steady incremental changes, that happen at the pace that is right for the client, not at a pace that just flatters the therapists ego, at the expence of the clients integrity.


Love and hugs,


Fable

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Permalink Reply by Michael Haifleigh on July 7, 2009 at 5:45pm

Fable,

Well said. My view, this work is all about assisting the client in making the change they are looking for.
The point you bring up about the other relationships in the clients life is a very good one. Other people in the client's life can be viewed as very powerful anchors for ideas and behaviors. When the client starts making a change in their life it will cascade.

Michael

Fable Goodman said:

One still needs to work at the pace that the client can assimilate, and integrate the changes in their life. Also the clients friends and aquainatances, will have reactions to any change, (the ripple effect) and the client needs to be able to assimilate their reactions and still keep moving forward at a pace that fits both themself and their contacts.

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Permalink Reply by Antonio on July 7, 2009 at 8:39pm

I personally have always liked the idea of phrasing an affirmation as a question...such as:

"why am I so confident?"

"how have I become so confident?"

"why are people happy to be my friend?

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