Self-Policing and Regulation in the Hypnotherapy Profession

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Richard Clark MFT on September 22, 2011 at 7:27am

Great Question Kathleen!

 

I think that there is nothing that can be done. Perhaps someone can disuade me from this thought (I hope so) however it seems unless you are willing to open yourself up to retaliation, personally, professionally, publicly, and/or legally, you have to just grin and bare it.

 

I can put names to every catagory you listed above. For some of them dozens of names. I haven't a clue what I can do about it.

 

Richard

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by James Malone on September 22, 2011 at 9:52am

There isn't much that can be done apart from reporting the person to the certifying organization they belong to. The better ones can and do censure and sometimes expel members who violate ethical boundaries. Keep in mind they do not publicize these expulsions, but they do happen.  As for things like sexual abuse, that crosses the line into criminal behavior and the person should be reported to law enforcement.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Kathleen Hanover on September 22, 2011 at 10:28am

It seems the biggest issue with self-policing is lack of some kind of enforcement mechanism. The simple way for an unethical hack to avoid getting thrown out by a certifying organization is to not join one in the first place. And unfortunately, seducing your hypnosis client is perfectly legal (if repulsive) in many jurisdictions that don't regulate hypnotherapy.

 

I remember 20 years ago, when I had a debilitating back injury. An acquaintance saw me struggling to get out of a car, and when I told her I had unrelenting muscle spasms from a herniated disc, she grabbed my hand and wrote her massage therapist's phone number on the back of it.

 

I found the idea of going to a massage therapist to be pretty creepy at the time. I had never seen a massage therapist before, and the only time you ever heard the word "massage" was when it was followed by the word "parlor." Basically, my only understanding of massage was that it was sleazy, sexual, and barely-disguised prostitution. Now, of course, massage therapy is pretty universally recognized as a legitimate complementary medicine/healing modality. (And yet, there's still a section of sleazy massage parlors in every phone book.)

 

What was it that enabled massage therapy to undergo such a successful rebranding--even in places where sleazy massage parlors still exist? Was it government regulation, or industry education, or PR or marketing? Or word of mouth?

 

I don't even know if you can say any longer that the massage parlors give legitimate massage therapists a bad name. It's understood that they're entirely different professions.

 

Just some rambly thoughts.

 

James Malone said:

There isn't much that can be done apart from reporting the person to the certifying organization they belong to. The better ones can and do censure and sometimes expel members who violate ethical boundaries. Keep in mind they do not publicize these expulsions, but they do happen.  As for things like sexual abuse, that crosses the line into criminal behavior and the person should be reported to law enforcement.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Saul Rosenfeld on September 22, 2011 at 9:05pm

Kathleen,

 

That is undoubtedly one of the (perhaps even "the") most pertinent questions ever asked on this Forum!

 

Richard,

 

That is undoubtedly one of the (perhaps even "the") saddest replies ever made on this Forum!  I wish there was some way I could disuade you from that thought, and I'll definitely try to think of some feasible options. But right now it's 2:00 a.m. here on the East coast, and I'm heading off to bed.

To be continued...

 

 

 

 

Richard Clark MFT said:

Great Question Kathleen!

 

I think that there is nothing that can be done. Perhaps someone can disuade me from this thought (I hope so) however it seems unless you are willing to open yourself up to retaliation, personally, professionally, publicly, and/or legally, you have to just grin and bare it.

 

I can put names to every catagory you listed above. For some of them dozens of names. I haven't a clue what I can do about it.

 

Richard

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Saul Rosenfeld on September 23, 2011 at 8:16am

Kathleen & Richard,

 

It might be easier to look at this a a "three-part" problem:

1. actions that could be construed as "illegal";

2. actions that are either morally or ethically reprehensible; and

3  actions resulting from ignorance and/or incompetence.

 

As far as the first category goes, it shouldn't be hard to report anyone "sexually abusing clients" to the appropriate authorities. It would probably only take a notarized sworn statement from the plaintiff to protect oneself from being sued for slander; but to make certain of this-  a call to either your local prosecutor's office or the police would take the guesswork out of it.  I would show no mercy whatsoever towards anyone guilty of such a despicable crime- and would like to see them all incarcerated. Just imagine if he would do such a thing to YOUR wife, or sister, or daughter!

 

The second category is more of a "slippery slope", because not everyone subscribes to the same ethical or moral code. I've seen and read about MANY "stunts" performed by stage hypnotists that I consider morally reprehensible (if not downright disgusting), but others obviously have no problem either eliciting or watching such stunts.  It is precisely because there are no set "rules or standards of conduct" that I am so opposed to ALL exhibitions of stage (and street) hypnosis.  I realize there are a (statistically tiny) number of folks out there who DO try adhere to ethical guidelines, but this is purely "voluntary", and at present there is NO law that "requires" stage hypnotists to refrain from doing pretty much whatever they want to with their subjects.

 

The third category is perhaps the most frustrating of all, and I suspect that the "dozens of names" that Richard refers to are those of ignorant/incompetent hypnotists he's come across.  No, there is NO form of "quality control" in this profession. None whatsoever. And, as a result, the ranks of hypnotists are literally filled with ignorant bumbling amateurs who make a mockery of the idea of "professional standards".  Why are they then able to successfully hypnotize? Because many people are SO easy to hypnotize that (to borrow a popular line from a commercial) "even a caveman can do it".  Once again, because there are NO "set standards" for being allowed to call oneself a "hypnotist", and no form of "mandated quality control", and no real legal restrictions on hypnotizing "clients"-   it's just a "free for all" out there, and "widows and orphans beware".

Sadly enough, this doesn't just apply to "lay" hypnotists-  but also to those with proper academic credentials in OTHER fields (including Ph.D's in psychology and M.D.s), who have "graduated" from courses or seminars in hypnosis while still being woefully unsuited to use this modality on their patients.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Richard Clark MFT said:

Great Question Kathleen!

 

I think that there is nothing that can be done. Perhaps someone can disuade me from this thought (I hope so) however it seems unless you are willing to open yourself up to retaliation, personally, professionally, publicly, and/or legally, you have to just grin and bare it.

 

I can put names to every catagory you listed above. For some of them dozens of names. I haven't a clue what I can do about it.

 

Richard

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on September 23, 2011 at 10:30am

The challenge here is that we can not regulate or control human behavior and people can be dirt-bags regardless of their education, trainings, certifications and/or licenses... 

What would you personally do if you discovered that a fellow hypnotherapist was seducing or sexually abusing clients?

 

The very few times I have had contact with people who felt that they were sexually and/or emotionally abused by a hypnotist they were clear that they did not want to make their experience public and I respected their confidentiality and privacy. If a hypno was publicly accused of sexual abuse, I would remind myself that people are innocent until proven otherwise and evaluate the evidence offered by both sides and share my opinion based on the evidence.

What would you personally do if you discovered that a fellow hypnotherapist was breaching client confidentiality?

I would educate the hypno about the serious consequences for violating of his or her clients rights to privacy which include possible legal and civil consequences and distance myself professionally --If the hypno belonged to a certifying organization - I would file a complaint and ask them to address his or her unethical behavior 

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Saul Rosenfeld on September 23, 2011 at 10:49am

"The challenge here is that we can not regulate or control human behavior and people can be dirt-bags regardless of their education, trainings, certifications and/or licenses... "

 

Michael,

 

I agree that we cannot "control" human behavior.  That being said however, other professions such as physician and lawyer have regulatory governing bodies that were specifically designed to censure or even eject any dirt-bags who violate their collective moral guidelines.  What's more, when their members exceed such "moral" standards to the point where they're actually committing illegal acts, their licenses are revoked and they are imprisoned.

On the other hand, hypnotists who transgress all manner of ethical standards can be threatened with nothing. So-called "certification" is completely unnecessary to practice hypnosis. The various "degrees" bestowed by various Institutes are, for all practical purposes, not worth the paper they're printed on.  Any 16 year-old upstart is fully able, under the law, to treat patients (called "clients") for all manner of emotional and psychological problems, or even physical disorders!  They may not be permitted (in some states) to call themselves "hypnotherapists", but that's the ONLY restriction.

While attempts are made, by various institutions, to produce competent and ethically responsible hypnos, it remains strictly "voluntary", and there is absolutely NO question of there being ANY kind of "legally binding" "quality control".

Add to this the fact that our collective image and reputation has been sullied and dragged through the muck for the past 235 years, and it's little wonder that SO many people remain wary, if not downright frightened, at the thought of placing their trust in the hands of a "hypnotist".

 

 

 

 

 

 

Michael Ellner said:

The challenge here is that we can not regulate or control human behavior and people can be dirt-bags regardless of their education, trainings, certifications and/or licenses... 

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Brian David Phillips on September 23, 2011 at 6:05pm

I think Richard's point is a very good one: "Perhaps someone can disuade me from this thought (I hope so) however it seems unless you are willing to open yourself up to retaliation, personally, professionally, publicly, and/or legally, you have to just grin and bare it."

 

I know folks who fit the categories Kathleen mentions above and a number of categories she did not list.  However, I also know folks who were accused of such things out of spite or professional jealousy or for being disgruntled for this or that reason.  It's a slippery slope.

 

As to me . . . I am perfectly happy to have regulation . . . as long as I'm the one writing the regulations. :-)

 

That is an iffy proposition as to who determines what is or isn't "ethical" or "appropriate"?  The hypnosis community does not just reflect therapists alone or even therapists who only practice a certain modality.  When you start pushing for regulation, almost invariably someone with an agenda maneuvers into the driver's seat and we end up with the mess in Indiana or the dropped ball in New York or elsewhere.

 

Some folks have very different ideas about what's acceptable practice and what's private life.  If something is legal in many jurisdictions but not legal in another is it considered unethical for someone who lives and practices in a jurisdiction where the behavior is allowed?

 

At what point do we determine who can or can't practice hypnosis?  A comment was made above about teenagers but what about doctors or nurses or folks who have not studied with this or that person's favored program or in a modality they prefer?  Are folks who use EFT ethical or not?  Certainly some folks lump that modality in with the spurious approaches because of the rationale often given for its efficacy while others think it's fine.  What about folks who use past life regression?

 

There are folks in the psychology department at the university where I teach who advocate rules in which only persons with a post-graduate level of education in psychology are allowed to learn hypnosis, a view I disagree with vehemently.  So obviously they would not be happy with guidelines I write and I would chaffe at theirs.  A friend of mine was the ethics chair of a major professional licensed oversight organization who tells me it hurt him in the soul when he was on a review committee back in the day that was forced to revoke the license of a doctor who had taught hypnosis to his nurses because at that time (long ago, thankfully) that was considered an ethics violation.  The doctor's rationale?  Nurses see the patient first and therefore are the ones most effective at offering immediate assistance.  The fact that the doctor's reasoning was sound wasn't enough and he lost his practice at that time.

 

What about stage hypnosis?  Some folks look at stage hypnosis and see evil, humiliation, and worse . . . what about hypnotherapists who also do shows?  Are they to be lumped in with the folks listed above?

 

Some organizations have very narrow guidelines as to what is or isn't acceptable for their members while others give a great deal of leeway.

 

Honestly, I would rather organizations police their own, although the most they can do is remove membership or apply censure.  If there is a push for a full on regulatory commission, I suspect it would do more damage than good.  I'd rather see things remain generally open . . . as to incompetence or the like, folks who practice as a business are subject to the same business regulations as anyone else and there is nothing stopping a hypnosis category being created in some of the consumer advocacy ratings systems listed previously.

 

However, I would suggest taking such ratings with a grain of salt as they are currently manipulated by some folks who do indeed hire folks to post positive ratings while others are perfectly happy to lodge spurious or false claims just to screw with someone they don't like (something I also have personal knowledge of from seeing it done to a number of folks I know personally).  Heck, there a number of folks who run routines to mass click dislike buttons on competitor's youtube videos.  Certainly, if such persons were deciding what the "rules" were for general professional behavior they would write the guidelines in a way that enhanced their own position and harmed the position of those they find distasteful from stage to recreational or other contexts.

 

I am not saying that the concerns Kathleen listed above are not serious . . . I've been an advocate for competency for years and more . . . but, I have seen the discussion hijacked too often by folks who have a very clear agenda that is not to the benefit of all or even to the consumer but intended to increase their own power and market share or eliminate their competition or censure those they just don't like.

 

Tread ye lightly and all that.

 

- Brian

 

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Lisa on September 24, 2011 at 2:16am

Hi Kathleen,

    Hypnotherapy is a very curious mixture of very highly specialized and very diverse parts. People are attracted to the field for many very diverse reasons. In this field there are saints and demons, healers and fools. Not unlike every other field on the planet. The difference from most other fields is it has the power to effect other human beings very profoundly. It doesn't always for many reasons and for reasons that are understood and not understood but it can effect people in very real and lasting ways.

    I think the field of hypnotherapy needs a way to hold incompetent and unethical practitioners accountable for their actions. I believe it is possible to find a way to do this that doesn't penalize gifted and skilled people and also doesn't give incompetent degreed/licensed hacks a "pass go collect" unwarranted advantage or a veneer beyond what they would already have from their legitimate license. There needs to be a way to at least try to protect/warn clients balanced with a way to be fair and impartial towards practitioners. This is complicated. Because there are just some people you will never please, that may or may not really understand anything about hypnosis, could be very vindictive. Part of this regulating agency would have to have the ability to investigate claims against practitioners for validity and seriousness like the APA and AMA has. 

  How do you evaluate basic competence? It is usually left to being assumed by number of minimum client practice hours.

Other agencies in particular paramedics and EMTs have a basic standard of care that includes did they do in a given case what another emt or paramedic would reasonably do in similar conditions. 

How do you develop minimum ethical standards? Consensus and codification of publicly available ethical standards and on a case by case basis. Some ethical issues are obvious and widely shared among practitioners, some are not-that is why it must be codified and publicly available.

 

   No, policing itself can't be left up to individual hypnotherapy practitioners. It just won't happen. Human nature prevents it and individual hypnotherapists don't have the resources or training to do such a thing to be fair and impartial to all involved.

Also there is very little or in most cases no way to prevent and or protect all parties involved. 

This is very much more complicated in regards to therapy and hypnotherapy specifically because both memory and perception can be malleable and messed with intentionally and unintentionally. 

A person can do a lot of damage before what they do becomes actionable under any law. You can't prevent someone from practicing in hypnotherapy in the US.

This must change. Laws and policies mean nothing if there are no teeth.

Who should decide this? A specially trained and appointed group of their peers. Both degreed and non degreed. They need access to both or all parties and to records of the session which should be mandatory for all clients and practitioners. Yes, it is a pita but part of certification and training should include record and form keeping.

If you don't make and keep records of your clients and sessions-you are courting getting sued and losing everything. I don't feel sorry for stupid and lazy. Having insurance is only half of what you need to do. 

 

  If I discovered a fellow hypnotherapist harming clients-Id talk to the practitioner first if we are friends. if it is legally actionable I'd encourage the client to make a police report and file charges. If not and I felt very sure about what the client believes happened, and they were harmed, in part based upon what I felt about what I got from speaking to the practitioner in question-I'd be honor bound to take any and all action available to me but not limited to:

ending the friendship, no referrels, warning other practioners including members of their practice group, refuse to work with them in any capacity. 

  I might not do all of this or might resume the friendship if they admitted to what they had done and committed to getting real help and never did it again. They would have to ensure that the damage they did was undone or neutralized by themselves or by another colleague. They should pay for this repair if they caused the damage. 

  If I failed to take reasonable action knowing that what my friend or colleague had done I am as bad as that individual and because of my knowledge of their behavior-would be responsible, once aware of what they were doing, for every client they harmed in the future. Because I knew and failed to take action available to me.

   Knowing that a colleague is seducing or abusing clients and saying and doing nothing makes you as guilty as they are.    If you are doing something that you wouldn't be proud of presenting as a case study to your fellow hypnotherapists or have your own mom hear about-maybe you should be reconsidering whether that is really an ok thing to do to other human beings.  

     Yes, I have twice been in the situation in my job where I had to report a friend for dangerous incompetence, and another  for clear and demonstrated abuse and physical danger to others. The most recent and worse case by far in seriousness occurred last year. She was a friend I had known and worked with for years. I hated hated hated having to do it. I personally witnessed some her irrational, abusive and dangerous behavior. She was a danger to herself and others. I am heart-sick that I had to report her. I sure as hell didn't want to but not taking action would have been much worse. 

 

   In regards to hypnotherapy-this isn't some kind of parlor game, this is a serious responsibility that has real impact on the lives and wellbeing of other human beings. Clients place their trust in you. If fulfilling your needs is more important than treating your clients with dignity and respect-please tear up your certification and flip burgers. Same for any slimy mealymouthed cowardly cohort that would tacitly approve of unethical and abusive behavior. McDonalds, Dominos, and Burger King are always hiring.

gentle morning,

Lisa

 

 

 

 

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on September 24, 2011 at 5:27am

@ Richard,

You hit the nail on the head -- 

"Perhaps someone can disuade me from this thought (I hope so) however it seems unless you are willing to open yourself up to retaliation, personally, professionally, publicly, and/or legally, you have to just grin and bare it."

===

I believe that we haven't earned the professional trust and respect that we seek if we are not willing to open ourselves up to retaliation, personally, professionally, publicly, and/or legally and speak out against hypnotists who are abusing their clients .

@ Lisa and Saul,

The widely held belief that state medical and psychological boards police their own and protect the public is "schtuss" to use a highly technical term.

There is compelling evidence that most of the serious harm is done by repeat offenders... The suspension and loss of license is usually reserved for responsible and caring practitioners who have the courage to offer their patients alternatives to the standards of care. 

http://www.citizen.org/congress/article_redirect.cfm?ID=8308.

@ Brian D. P.-

I agree with most of what you post, but I am confused by your references to the "mess in Indiana" and the dropped ball in "New York" Indiana publicly reversed their prohibitive hypnosis regulations because it became clear that the public did not need to be protected from hypnotists who were not also licensed as health care providers and New York continues to have laws that are very friendly to hypnosis professionals.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Lisa on September 24, 2011 at 5:32am

Hi Don,

     Good thing we are not too big-yet. I would far rather regulation and policing come from within rather than outside of the field. The mish mash crazy quilt that exists now might just as well not exist for all that it really can do which is basically nothing.

      There are things that I am certified to do in my job that if I violate certain rules that may not do anyone any harm and heck the person may never even know about-I can still go to prison for up to 10 years and be fined $50,000 minimum. For doing something much less damaging than what could be done by an unethical hypnotherapist or any therapist. My freedom could be taken away, financially destroyed for at least decades, and be unemployable in my current field. 

Every 2 years all dispatchers (in Georgia) must take a class in this-security and integrity, to be reminded of it and retain their certification.

    It boggles my mind that there are no real consequences beyond a guilty conscious for people who are entrusted with the minds and wellbeing of others.

   You point about the Catholic church is well taken. Hate to see that happen to hypnotherapy. It is sad enough to see it happen to the Catholic church and I am an atheist :)

gentle day,

Lisa 

Don said:

 

And so it is with the professions which operate within a given society. They are not accepted as an integral of the larger group unless they too make some effort to regulate the sexual and aggressive impulses of their members. If they wait too long in order to do so, as soon as they grow big enough to be considered a threat, then the larger society will do it for them.

 

 

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Lisa on September 24, 2011 at 6:24am

Hi Michael,

   I very much agree with several points in the article you linked particularly this part:

 

"7. Open the National Practitioner Data Bank. Information about doctor discipline, including state sanctions, hospital disciplinary actions and medical malpractice awards is now contained in the National Practitioner Data Bank. HMOs, hospitals and medical boards can look at the National Practitioner Data Bank. Unfortunately, consumers cannot because the names of physicians in the database are kept secret from the public. Congress should lift the veil of secrecy and allow the people who have the most to lose from questionable doctors to get the information they need to protect themselves and their families. But until Congress finds the will to open up this information, Public Citizen will provide the public with as much of the data as we can obtain."

 

  and:

 

"1. Reform medical board governance. States should sever any remaining formal, debilitating links between state licensing boards and state medical societies. Members of medical boards (and separate disciplinary boards, where present) should be appointed by the governor, and the governor’s choice of appointees should not be limited to a medical society’s nominees. At least 50 percent of the members of each state medical board and disciplinary board should be well-informed and well-trained public members who have no ties to health care providers and who, preferably, have a history of advocacy on behalf of patients. The governor should appoint members to the Medical Board whose top priority is protecting the public’s health, not providing assistance to physicians who are trying to evade disciplinary actions."

 

  I don't like getting government involved but if that is what it takes perhaps it should be considered. I agree with the article you linked in that rehabilitation of offenders in malpractice should not be the boards primary concern. I agree that there should be more oversight with physicians. How much is there with hypnotherapists in your experience?  There needs to be some at least.

  The article you linked shows clearly what not to do in making a hypnotherapy regulating/policing board and a lot of good things to consider doing to avoid the mistakes that medical and psychological boards make. Practitioners do need protection, but the primary concern of a board should be protecting clients as much as possible more than rehabilitating practitioners because that article pretty strongly shows-that does not work well and results in unacceptably high recidivism. No group is going to be infallible-but it will be better than no regulation or policing at all. Perhaps we can avoid making the mistakes pointed out in that article.

I do think people can change but I am a great fan of "Fool me once-shame on you, fool me twice-shame on me" when it comes to regulatory bodies. 

 

 "I believe that we haven't earned the professional trust and respect that we seek if we are not willing to open ourselves up to retaliation, personally, professionally, publicly, and/or legally and speak out against hypnotists who are abusing their clients ."

   I couldn't agree with you more.  

gentle day,

Lisa

 

Thanks for the article.

gentle day,

Lisa

Michael Ellner said:

@ Lisa and Saul,

The widely held belief that state medical and psychological boards police their own and protect the public is "schtuss" to use a highly technical term.

There is compelling evidence that most of the serious harm is done by repeat offenders... The suspension and loss of license is usually reserved for responsible and caring practitioners who have the courage to offer their patients alternatives to the standards of care. 

http://www.citizen.org/congress/article_redirect.cfm?ID=8308.

• ▶ Reply

▶ Reply to Discussion

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• 3
• …
• 15
• Next ›
• Page