Simple Brain Washing --

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Permalink Reply by Donna Carter on February 2, 2010 at 9:16am

yes.
repetition is hypnotic.
couldn't we go further and say - anything that uses the word 'conditioning' when it comes to behavior - is a hypnotic process?
~D.

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Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on February 2, 2010 at 9:24am

We could - Donna and I do...

If it involves 'conditioning' behaviors -- It is a hypnotic process.

Best,
Michael E.


Donna Rodolph said:

yes.
repetition is hypnotic.
couldn't we go further and say - anything that uses the word 'conditioning' when it comes to behavior - is a hypnotic process?
~D.

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Permalink Reply by Connor Wyatt on February 2, 2010 at 11:39am

Ah the Solomon Asch Conformity experiment. I think that a few hypnotic phenomenon were going on, for example some of the people who were real participants reported distortion of perception, meaning they actually saw the lines as the same length. This was because of belief so I think it was partially hypnotic.

On the other hand there was what is known as Normative Conformity, as mentioned in the video, going on there. This was because they didn't want to look stupid or be the "odd one out."

So I believe it is partially belief and distortion for some participants and for others, just plain old social influence.

Hope to have helped as this is on the A Level curriculum for Psychology and I must have revised Asch and Milgram's experiments a thousand times by now!

I like how it is called "Brain Washing" though! There was no brain washing involved at all, the person who uploaded it just doesn't have a clue lol.

Also guys I disagree with the fact that repetition is hypnotic. I think it is a hypnotic technique but on it's own I don't think it is entirely hypnotic. For example, Ivan Pavlov and his dogs experiment, he does use repetition but i don't think classical conditioning works on that basis. It is to create a "Stimulus-Response Association" and, yes it does happen unconsciously but I don't know whether I would call it hypnosis. I don't know though, as I say, that's just my opinion.

Conca ; )

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Permalink Reply by Dr Terence Kindleton PhD on February 2, 2010 at 12:03pm

Hello everyone, I'm new to the whole internet forum thing but I thought I'd start by sharing my view with you.

Also hi to you young man, you seem very knowledgable about psychology and the human psyche and I look forward to talking to you soon.

People, I think Conca has hit the nail on the head, the Asch experiment was about exactly that, conformity. In this socio-economic climate we live in, people are scared to express an opinion and be different from the rest. That is why people aspire to be glamour models and the like, because they want to be the one making a statement but they're too shy to speak up.

I look forward to speaking to you all.

Best regards,

Terence

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Permalink Reply by Kelley Woods on February 2, 2010 at 1:54pm

Thanks, Michael...it is a classic test of people's desire for group acceptance and conformity. This is demonstrated by not only the response of the "subject", but by the haircuts of all involved! yikes!

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Permalink Reply by John Cleesattel on February 2, 2010 at 3:07pm

Donna,
I have found that repetition is the learning by the reactive mind of a future automatic reaction. Conditioning is a reference to this process.

Just my two cents
John

Donna Rodolph said:

yes.
repetition is hypnotic.
couldn't we go further and say - anything that uses the word 'conditioning' when it comes to behavior - is a hypnotic process?
~D.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Roy Hunter on February 4, 2010 at 11:23am

I like what Charles Tebbetts taught regarding subconscious programming: that there are five ways to program the subconscious. I call them the five gateways:

1. Repetition (this works, provided there is minimal subconscious resistance). Smoking triggers are anchored deeply in the subconscious through years of repetition.

2. Authority figures (pushing the "obey" or "rebel" button): Authority figures can be parents, teachers, government, religion, or even "authority wantabe" that pushes the "rebel" button.

3. Identification (desire for identity): This is the ego-driven desire to be like the crowd, or different from the crowd, and/or receive praise or recognition and/or attention. Example: how many people do things because of peer pressure?

4. Hypnosis and self-hypnosis.

5. Emotion: This is the motivating power of the mind. When we are emotional, we are more vulnerable to doing what we imagine doing, regardless of whether the emotion is positive or negative. I use hypnosis to increase a person's emotional desire to achieve his or her desired goal by asking the client to identify his/her BENEFITS for achieving that goal.

While the above may not be all-inclusive, it has been a good working model for my work with clients for 27 years now. Analytical clients find it helpful when I devote a session to discussing these subconscious gateways. Also, it is my opinion that brainwashing includes most if not all of the gateways. We can easily see how that occurs with religious cults.

Roy

Roy Hunter, Ph.D., FAPHP
www.royhunter.com

John Cleesattel said:

Donna,
I have found that repetition is the learning by the reactive mind of a future automatic reaction. Conditioning is a reference to this process.

Just my two cents
John

Donna Rodolph said:

yes.
repetition is hypnotic.
couldn't we go further and say - anything that uses the word 'conditioning' when it comes to behavior - is a hypnotic process?
~D.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on February 5, 2010 at 3:46am

Hi,

I imagine the 7 key elements of hypnotism as being, in no particular order: perceived authority, fixation, suggestion, repetition, confusion, imagination, and post-hypnotic suggestion.

Roy Hunter said:

I like what Charles Tebbetts taught regarding subconscious programming: that there are five ways to program the subconscious. I call them the five gateways:

1. Repetition (this works, provided there is minimal subconscious resistance). Smoking triggers are anchored deeply in the subconscious through years of repetition.

2. Authority figures (pushing the "obey" or "rebel" button): Authority figures can be parents, teachers, government, religion, or even "authority wantabe" that pushes the "rebel" button.

3. Identification (desire for identity): This is the ego-driven desire to be like the crowd, or different from the crowd, and/or receive praise or recognition and/or attention. Example: how many people do things because of peer pressure?

4. Hypnosis and self-hypnosis.

5. Emotion: This is the motivating power of the mind. When we are emotional, we are more vulnerable to doing what we imagine doing, regardless of whether the emotion is positive or negative. I use hypnosis to increase a person's emotional desire to achieve his or her desired goal by asking the client to identify his/her BENEFITS for achieving that goal.

While the above may not be all-inclusive, it has been a good working model for my work with clients for 27 years now. Analytical clients find it helpful when I devote a session to discussing these subconscious gateways. Also, it is my opinion that brainwashing includes most if not all of the gateways. We can easily see how that occurs with religious cults.

Roy

Roy Hunter, Ph.D., FAPHP
www.royhunter.com

John Cleesattel said:

Donna,
I have found that repetition is the learning by the reactive mind of a future automatic reaction. Conditioning is a reference to this process.

Just my two cents
John

Donna Rodolph said:

yes.
repetition is hypnotic.
couldn't we go further and say - anything that uses the word 'conditioning' when it comes to behavior - is a hypnotic process?
~D.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Hugh Cole on February 5, 2010 at 5:32am

Lots of great answers here, I agree with Ian which is what I read into Conca's answer, The social proof work of the 1950's was very much dependant on the social situations surrounding it. I view the idea of "brain washing" slightly differantly, There are many uses for hypnosis but hypnosis alone is merely a tool. To obtain permanent, positive change in an individual, The desired response must be trained into the person and then conditioned so that it becomes automatic. (ie just what they automatically think or do). Repetition alone won't cut it, but repetition used in conjunction with other hypnotic processes will allow the learning to become permanent,
There is a sentence (suggestion if you prefer) I use in my pretalk... "Everyone is suggestible, because if you weren't suggestible .. you couldn't learn" That sort of sums up a useful belief that I like to hold. So to me learning is a hypnotic process but not necessarily hypnosis (per se).


Hugh Cole
The Pretty Goodest Hypnotist on the planet

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