What angle to come from???

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Permalink Reply by Roy Hunter on July 17, 2010 at 9:37am

Some clients do not want to accept any responsibility for their success. Rather, they want you to DO it TO them, and provide a "quick fix" with hypnosis that makes them succeed without any effort on their part.

Often (but not always) this is a client who was manipulated by spouse or physician into quitting smoking or losing weight even though it might be contrary to what the client really wants to do.

First, I endeavor to make certain that the client is making the choice by his/her own free will. Sometimes I say: "I have good news and bad news...the good news is that I cannot MAKE you change, I can only HELP you change provided YOU make the choice to do so. That's also the bad news, because a quick fix can backfire if you are only doing this to please someone else."

Also note that you are not obligated to accept every prospective client who walks through your door. I often offer a free thirty minute consultation as a "two-way screening process" in order to help both me and the client determine whether I'm the right person for him/her to see.

Roy Hunter

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Permalink Reply by amber lee poole on July 17, 2010 at 3:19pm

Thanx Roy, Kathleen and Graham!

Kathleen, i am hearing you from your good intent and your reply was great :) I think that in reading yours and Roy's response it is the exact way it went down yesterday. 2 sides of the same coin....

I, as a therapist, make sure that i completely listen to a client and repeat back to them some of the key things they might have said, in order for us to contemplate whether those things that really stood out is where we should work from first.... even though some of those things might be painful, it usually feels right and we go ahead. So, thank you for your suggestions, i feel i do this well.

Where it all came unstuck is that each time i would repeat the so called "cause" or reason she was giving to me back to her, so we could go down that path in hypnosis (i always confirm with a client before trance that the way i'm going to proceed is what they are comfortable with) she would deny she said it or become very defensive.... then she would flip to something completely different... it completely felt like fear to me: fear of what i don't know, could simply just be fear of being hypnotised by me - fear of an outcome, fear of no outcome at all.... these are feelings i was getting and i kept trying to bring her back to some kind of clarity.....i just wanted one thing i could work with!!!!! lol

So, to Kathleen again, if it is our role to guide and we have a client that will not accept even what they are telling us, what do we do?!?!!!?!?! She walked in very adamant that the issue was with her mother and childhood so when i said ok, that's great let's work on that, she flipped to something else!

Roy: I totally get what you are saying and i feel that she actually didn't want the change, even though she said she did... it felt like she was being made to come and see me, reluctant, annoyed, defensive, etc although she doesn't have anyone in her life telling her to come - she did explain to me that her mother had always commented on her weight and was always trying to ger her to diet.... so could still be that left over energy from this (her mother is no longer living). I don't feel she really wanted to be there....and she told me that when she saw me standing out in reception she became uncomfortable....

Anyway, i'm going to chalk it up to experience and i totally understand that not everyone is going to gel with me, or me to them, I just need to speak to the clinic owner and work out a way that doesn't affect the clinic if i decide not to work with someone - or them with me :) Maybe get the receptionist to explain that the first part of the session is seeing whether we can work together, and if we are both happy the full session will go ahead - thanx Roy for making that even clearer for me and guiding me to how i can do this.

I must admit, i'm not feeling very good about seeing her again next week - I might call her through the week, see how she is progressing with the "homework" i gave her and if i don't feel we are gelling, i might suggest she see someone else??

Amber xo

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Permalink Reply by Kathleen Hanover on July 17, 2010 at 5:20pm

Hi Amber,

Sometimes people just aren't a good fit, for whatever reason.

I will reiterate what others have said...you're not obligated to work with anyone...and you're especially not obligated to work with someone who doesn't as yet seem motivated enough to get with the program.

Now I'm speaking as a marketer and salesperson. If this prospect believes you can help her, and is in enough pain to make a purchase decision, and has the money, she will work with you. But all three of those have to be true for her to pull the trigger.

I believe in honesty in the sales process. Tell her the truth, whatever it is, in a nurturing way. If the truth is that you don't think you're the best therapist for her, tell her so (without saying anything negative about either of you.) If the truth is that you don't think she's motivated enough or focused enough to succeed right now, tell her so (again, without saying anything negative about either of you.) You can do this in the form of a third-party story. ("You know, I've found that the people who are most successful are the people who [whatever]....and I really only want to work together if I'm absolutely convinced it will be good for both of us.")

Some people would call this the "takeaway close."

What's great about the takeaway close is that it helps you get to the truth. If the truth is that she's really ready, she'll move toward what she wants when you start to take it away from her. If the truth is that she's not ready, she'll agree that she's not ready.

Everybody wins, because then you both know the truth, and you've arrived at it in a mature and honest way. And you've done it quickly.

Hope this helps!

Kathleen

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Permalink Reply by amber lee poole on July 17, 2010 at 7:59pm

Perfect Kathleen!

Thank you so much - have learnt a lot in the last couple of days and appreciate all that have taken the time to help me with this issue xox

Feel very clear and content with my next action.

Amber

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Permalink Reply by Michael White on July 18, 2010 at 10:38am

ALP,

I'm going to continue the string of "use what you're getting" as the way.

When I read "Deep seated" I thought, "well if those two words aren't enough source material to induce a trance, I don't know what is?"

Deep...seated...yes, from your childhood...yes...this is so deep seated, so deeply and profoundly seated that it's as if it's so far away and yet so close. Have you ever had and experience of something so far away and yet so close at the same time...now stay seated...I want you to stay seated right where you are, you already are and you are doing so well just being seated and you can also feel where you are seated...just like when you were a little girl...>>

Which to me is a possible model for her experience of the body she has been so desperately wanting...so far away and yet so close...or not. Who knows? Doesn't matter.

Use your flexibility (which you have beyond your knowing at this point). She's already "entranced", join her for a bit and then lead her to more of HER resources. This will make this much easier for you.

Great job and Great courage!

Michael

p.s. If this feels like a repeat, please just use as additional encouragement of YOU!


amber lee poole said:

Perfect Kathleen!

Thank you so much - have learnt a lot in the last couple of days and appreciate all that have taken the time to help me with this issue xox

Feel very clear and content with my next action.

Amber

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Permalink Reply by Kelley Woods on July 18, 2010 at 11:05am

Just in from a camping trip and caught your post here, Amber. I would like to tell you that I have experienced similar situations with clients, particularly weight loss clients. From the moment they entered my office I felt the defensiveness and, even more, the air of past failure about them. Like you, I almost dreaded working with them.

Until one day, while working with a karate kata that I disliked (it had some difficult and awkward-to-me moves) my sensei commented that I must embrace the things I detest or fear. I discovered that it was I who needed to put aside my own fears and lack of confidence and began to approach these clients with a new perspective.

While we all love working with positive people, with whom we easily establish rapport, these more challenging clients can help us develop our skills in amazing ways. If you consider the road that these people have stumbled along, you begin to understand how wonderful it is for them to finally encounter someone who can really help. Clients who presented with these types of attitudes have often become the most successful and, as a result, my strongest sources of referrals.

You have the opportunity to help this woman change her life. Hang in there with her and you may just find it to be one of the most rewarding cases you have enjoyed!

Best wishes,

Kelley

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Permalink Reply by amber lee poole on July 19, 2010 at 3:01am

To everyone,

The client rang and cancelled her appointment with me today....because she deals with reception i didn't get to chat with her. I must say i'm not surprised but was looking forward to seeing how i could help her, and learning from the whole experience - thank you Kelley for your kind words.

So, onwards and upwards!

Amber xox

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Permalink Reply by Licentious Maladay on July 31, 2010 at 8:08am

Speaking as a client, I have learned so much from this conversation. The only thing I would like to add is that you should help the client see each therapist as one stop on a much bigger journey. I have worked with several counselors, including a retired minister, several therapists, one psychiatrist and a couple of hypnotherapists. If I was searching for the "silver bullet" that would end all my troubles, then I would view each of them as a failure. If I was instead looking for someone who could help me, then I can honestly say that I learned something significant from each one.

My problem was deeper than what I presented to the therapists. Maybe I could have met someone perceptive enough from the first meeting to zero in on exactly what the problem was and ZAP it in one masterful stroke. My reality was that we needed to strip layer after layer off the onion until we got to the green shoot in the center where new growth could happen. And it was important for me to determine what I needed at each moment as well as giving the guide feedback on what was working and what was not. However, each step along the way provided significant relief as well as new insights into myself and those around me.

And I'm not done. As I establish new goals, I work on them myself. Whenever I get to an obstacle, I look for help, including the internet, my wife, my friends and some trusted professionals. It is a life long process and the fun is in the journey, not the arriving.

Lic

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Permalink Reply by Alexx D on August 2, 2010 at 11:12am

Just a few quick thoughts,

My first thought when I read your original post was I wonder if your client actually had a different reason to come see you than the weight issue that maybe she feels self conscious about? so the weight problem is kind of like a more generic foot in the door?

Also, her clinic.. she'd be very used to being in charge in that place.
Now, I don't know about you but I write a lot, and almost always at my desk. If I sit on my bed and try to write things I do but my words don't flow nearly as well. maybe that building for her has become a place to be in charge and all things she associates with being the boss of that clinic, maybe it was not the best place to have her follow you into a trance and make changes?

I think it speaks volumes that you also take a good look at yourself in this.
She came to you, or at least agreed to try this with you, despite a not so great experience before, so obviously she feels you could help her enough to not dismiss the idea of a session with you.. why?
I noticed that she canceled this last time, but my point was think about what it is that drew her to you in the first place.

Good luck
:)

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Permalink Reply by amber lee poole on August 2, 2010 at 2:08pm

Hi Alex,

Thanx for your time and reply... it isn't her clinic, she is a patient of the owner of the clinic i contract at. Since she has decided not to return to see me I have had other staff at the clinic express how horribly she is treating them, I have not shared with them my experience with her.

The feeling, and reactions, I got from her was frustration, defensiveness and blame - I agree with Roy, it felt like she was there because she "should" do something about her weight, not because "she" wanted to.... just in repeating exactly what she was saying to me, so we could get some level of where we needed to go, she would get very angry and switch to something completely different... she was challenging everything I said, and of course, she has a right to :)

I am grateful she came as it has alerted me to move to my next step in my learning and I have now started an NLP course, which I have wanted to do for the last year but wasn't able...i feel that her presence was a tap on my shoulder that i am ready to take my understanding to another level... it is just a shame that we couldn't have worked together, but i don't think i was the right person for her, or her for me, and i'm comfortable with this! Once again, Roy and others have expressed that we don't gel with everyone that walks through the door and although i have pushed past the occasional resistence with other clients, this one wasn't going to budge! Not with me anyway or not at that time :)

Amber xoxox

Alexx D said:

Just a few quick thoughts,

My first thought when I read your original post was I wonder if your client actually had a different reason to come see you than the weight issue that maybe she feels self conscious about? so the weight problem is kind of like a more generic foot in the door?

Also, her clinic.. she'd be very used to being in charge in that place.
Now, I don't know about you but I write a lot, and almost always at my desk. If I sit on my bed and try to write things I do but my words don't flow nearly as well. maybe that building for her has become a place to be in charge and all things she associates with being the boss of that clinic, maybe it was not the best place to have her follow you into a trance and make changes?

I think it speaks volumes that you also take a good look at yourself in this.
She came to you, or at least agreed to try this with you, despite a not so great experience before, so obviously she feels you could help her enough to not dismiss the idea of a session with you.. why?
I noticed that she canceled this last time, but my point was think about what it is that drew her to you in the first place.

Good luck
:)

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Permalink Reply by Alexx D on August 2, 2010 at 5:52pm

Yes I see your point. I do tend to see things from an optimistic point of view but not everyone is ready even if they feel they "should" be as you put it..
Have fun with the NLP course :)

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