the Free Hypnosis Social Network
What is trance?
Every now and then I encounter people who have varying opinions of what trance is and how it works. Just today I have read here where people think sleep is trance, or think that hypnosis doesn't need to involve trance at all.
So just what is trance?
In my formal training, I was taught "trance begins with 3 words....close...your...eyes." I have since found out that I was given misinformation about what trance was, and so that started me questioning everything, doing my own research, and writing a book about it, but that's another story.
Needless to say, that my own personal findings indicated that trance is a natural state for us as a species. Since the analytical mind can only focus on one thing at a time, we have to use a trance state to be able to multi-task.
Trance is simply a state where the reactive mind (subconscious) automatically reacts to outside input. Hypnosis takes advantage of this by realizing the outside input can be in the form of a suggestion.
To me; hypnosis is simply the means to induce a purposeful trance state. So it doesn't matter what method you use, if you have induced a trance state in someone, you have hypnotized them.
In our everyday lives, we are well used to using trance states with the conscious mind very active and aware.
Trance has nothing to do with if the eyes are open or shut, if you are nervous or relaxed, or anything else like that. The reason we use commands like sleep, relax, etc. is because for the most part, the subject is very familiar with the terms and understands how to automatically react to them, and it turns the focus of their mind further inside.
When ever our conscious mind is focused on something, especially on the inside of the body, a trance state HAS TO exist in order for us to keep maintaining.
A trance state does not bypass the critical factor unless the magnitude of the trance state (depth?) is sufficient to shut down that filter. We refer to that magnitude of trance as somnambulism, and during somnambulism our ability to determine what is real and true is impaired (what we call "the critical factor") which is why we get the trance effects and results we get with it.
I realize that we all have our models of hypnosis and trance, this is mine, and I would love to hear how you define trance.
John
So just what is trance?
In my formal training, I was taught "trance begins with 3 words....close...your...eyes." I have since found out that I was given misinformation about what trance was, and so that started me questioning everything, doing my own research, and writing a book about it, but that's another story.
Needless to say, that my own personal findings indicated that trance is a natural state for us as a species. Since the analytical mind can only focus on one thing at a time, we have to use a trance state to be able to multi-task.
Trance is simply a state where the reactive mind (subconscious) automatically reacts to outside input. Hypnosis takes advantage of this by realizing the outside input can be in the form of a suggestion.
To me; hypnosis is simply the means to induce a purposeful trance state. So it doesn't matter what method you use, if you have induced a trance state in someone, you have hypnotized them.
In our everyday lives, we are well used to using trance states with the conscious mind very active and aware.
Trance has nothing to do with if the eyes are open or shut, if you are nervous or relaxed, or anything else like that. The reason we use commands like sleep, relax, etc. is because for the most part, the subject is very familiar with the terms and understands how to automatically react to them, and it turns the focus of their mind further inside.
When ever our conscious mind is focused on something, especially on the inside of the body, a trance state HAS TO exist in order for us to keep maintaining.
A trance state does not bypass the critical factor unless the magnitude of the trance state (depth?) is sufficient to shut down that filter. We refer to that magnitude of trance as somnambulism, and during somnambulism our ability to determine what is real and true is impaired (what we call "the critical factor") which is why we get the trance effects and results we get with it.
I realize that we all have our models of hypnosis and trance, this is mine, and I would love to hear how you define trance.
John
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Jack Hirsh on -
My definition of trance is very simple, "a state of focused concentration". In my mind hypnosis and trance are not one in the same. Trance is the state and hypnosis is the use of that state. What I mean by this is a person can be in trance but not hypnotized. Hypnosis begins when the trance state is used to bypass the critical factor and then acceptable suggestions are fired in.
Good topic by the way. I can't wait to see other replies.
~Jack
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Permalink Reply by Susan French on -
If I'm not mistaken, the state we recognize as trance is when the brain wave frequencies slow down to Alpha frequency and a little bit of Theta frequency. The Alpha frequency is 8 to 13 cycles per second (or hertz). You can only go a few cycles per seconds of frequency into Theta before you go into the state we recognize as sleep.
I believe I also read that we go into alpha state every 90 minutes or so for about 15 minutes. I have a hunch (but have not read this anywhere) that the cognitive function (probably prefrontal cortex) disengages or relaxes and is less dominant. I think that what we metaphorically refer to as 'conscious mind' is the prefrontal cortex, the logical, reasoning part of the brain.
I have no clue what parts of the brain/body we mean when we say the 'subconscious mind',' I'd love to learn it if anyone knows.
I also believe that each brain wave frequency is present all the time at different levels of consciousness but one frequency becomes more dominant. I'm not sure about this though.
I'm always more comfortable when I take take something metaphorical (trance) and identify it in the physical and tangible, but that's me.
In my always present determination to take metaphors and make them tangible and concrete, I think of hypnosis as being the brain wave state that exists between a waking state and a sleeping state.
Susan
.
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Permalink Reply by Hugh Cole on -
Trance is what I am in right now, as I begin to imagine the best possible answer I can give you to the question "what is trance," Imagining that.. is a process of internalizing and accessing nominalizations that describe thoughts and concepts and subjective experiences I have had . Hypnosis is a process ... the process by which we establish trance. Trance is the establishment of a state of effective selective mental focus. (very simple and straightforward). When you add the condition of bypass of the critcal faculty you have somnambulism.,, The so called "hypnotic Trance". I think John, you and I are pretty much on the same page.
Hugh Cole
making them dizzy one post at a time
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Permalink Reply by bob burns on -
I'm very comfortable with what everyone has said on this and I'm not strongly disagreeing with you Hugh, BUT is there then no difference between to be in trance or deeply in thought. I suspect there is and that it's the depth of that thought that decides whether or not the thinker enters the state of trance. But maybe that's what you implied?
I claim (Many hypnotists arer unhappy with me for saying this) that I have never managed to hypnotise myself. That's because, although I can enter trance extremely easily I can never get my critical factor to leave the room. And I think that this is normally done by someone else (a hypnotist).
I often hear hypnotists say to their audience: "You enter hypnosis many times in a day", but if the critical factor is still in place I'd suggest that although they are definitely in trance they're not really in hypnosis.
I for example often found myself in tears at watching 'Little House on The Prairie' (no comments please!) But, although I would have been definitely entranced at that point I claim I was NOT in hypnosis at any time.
Comments please...?
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Permalink Reply by John Cleesattel on -
Bob,
I realize I have already said my piece in the intro of this discussion, but since you asked for comment, allow me to offer the example of learning to ride a bicycle. When first learning to ride the bike, we try to focus our attention on our feet, our hands, and where we are going, all at the same time, there is only one result. Crash. It is when we learn to automatically react to input from our feet and hands and just focus our attention on where we are going, that crash, turns into zoom.
This automatic reacting is what I describe as a trance state. With your example, deep in thought, that too is a trance state but not the deep in thought part, its the other part that handles your presence in the here and now for you while you are deep in thought. The same thing that drives for you when deep in thought on the highway, or pedals the bike while you look around. I hope that is a bit more clear.
John
bob burns said:I'm very comfortable with what everyone has said on this and I'm not strongly disagreeing with you Hugh, BUT is there then no difference between to be in trance or deeply in thought. I suspect there is and that it's the depth of that thought that decides whether or not the thinker enters the state of trance. But maybe that's what you implied?
I claim (Many hypnotists arer unhappy with me for saying this) that I have never managed to hypnotise myself. That's because, although I can enter trance extremely easily I can never get my critical factor to leave the room. And I think that this is normally done by someone else (a hypnotist). I often hear hypnotists say to their audience: "You enter hypnosis many times in a day", but if the critical factor is still in place I'd suggest that although they are definitely in trance they're not really in hypnosis. I for example often found myself in tears at watching 'Little House on The Prairie' (no comments please!) But, although I would have been definitely entranced at that point I claim I was NOT in hypnosis at any time.
Comments please...?
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Permalink Reply by Hugh Cole on
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Mr Green said:.
The trance must have a connection to hypnosis as its not something that a person can automatically 'do' people often find themselves 'snapping' out of a trance like waking up, maybe this is where the process is deepened meaning that hypnosis actually is just a deep fixed trance, only it involves more of the clients focus as rather than a natural occuring trance it is manufactured to bring results, phenomena etc..
So maybe 'a' trance is hypnosis in it's naturally occurring form...?
Interesting question.
Hypnosis is a process through which you obtain a guided directable trance. Trance is the state you obtain. There are many many unguided trance states, Trance is of course a naturally occuring state. It is how we, as upright biped trance machines, actually learn. In John's example, you learn things like balance and control and incorporate them as trance processes in your less than concious mind (no hypnosis involved) then you conciously "ride the bike", incorporating those less than concious learned processes,
As Hypnotists, we purposefully guide trance partners into a particularly useful state of trance called Somnambulism where anything we say becomes thier vivid reality... because... thier "imaginative involvement" is strong enough that they no longer analyze the suggestion. That is bypass of the critical faculty. There are of course many subjective qualities attached to somnambulism that can make it an even richer experience for some subjects ... but that's another thread,
Hugh Cole
Making them dizzy one post at a time
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Permalink Reply by Kelley Woods on -
Hugh, I'd love to hear your's and other's thoughts on those subjective qualities...I'll watch for the new thread!
:) Kelley
Hugh Cole said:Mr Green said:.
The trance must have a connection to hypnosis as its not something that a person can automatically 'do' people often find themselves 'snapping' out of a trance like waking up, maybe this is where the process is deepened meaning that hypnosis actually is just a deep fixed trance, only it involves more of the clients focus as rather than a natural occuring trance it is manufactured to bring results, phenomena etc..
So maybe 'a' trance is hypnosis in it's naturally occurring form...?
Interesting question.
Hypnosis is a process through which you obtain a guided directable trance. Trance is the state you obtain. There are many many unguided trance states, Trance is of course a naturally occuring state. It is how we, as upright biped trance machines, actually learn. In John's example, you learn things like balance and control and incorporate them as trance processes in your less than concious mind (no hypnosis involved) then you conciously "ride the bike", incorporating those less than concious learned processes,
As Hypnotists, we purposefully guide trance partners into a particularly useful state of trance called Somnambulism where anything we say becomes thier vivid reality... because... thier "imaginative involvement" is strong enough that they no longer analyze the suggestion. That is bypass of the critical faculty. There are of course many subjective qualities attached to somnambulism that can make it an even richer experience for some subjects ... but that's another thread,
Hugh Cole
Making them dizzy one post at a time
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Permalink Reply by James Hazlerig on -
"Trance" is a word I use when I'm too lazy to say "hypnosis." :-)
Truth is, I'm not really married to any definition of either word, but I think that every definition sheds some light on an experience that is very hard to express in words.
Thanks for stirring up the discussion, John.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on -
Hi Susan-
Although, the relatively newly discovered fast moving gamma brain waves have been linked to perception, meditation and focused attention, one challenge all hypnosis professional face is that modern technology has been unable to find a signature brain wave state that is unique to hypnosis. In that sense there is no such "thing" as a "hypnotic state"
Michael E.
Susan French said:If I'm not mistaken, the state we recognize as trance is when the brain wave frequencies slow down to Alpha frequency and a little bit of Theta frequency. The Alpha frequency is 8 to 13 cycles per second (or hertz). You can only go a few cycles per seconds of frequency into Theta before you go into the state we recognize as sleep.
I believe I also read that we go into alpha state every 90 minutes or so for about 15 minutes. I have a hunch (but have not read this anywhere) that the cognitive function (probably prefrontal cortex) disengages or relaxes and is less dominant. I think that what we metaphorically refer to as 'conscious mind' is the prefrontal cortex, the logical, reasoning part of the brain.
I have no clue what parts of the brain/body we mean when we say the 'subconscious mind',' I'd love to learn it if anyone knows.
I also believe that each brain wave frequency is present all the time at different levels of consciousness but one frequency becomes more dominant. I'm not sure about this though.
I'm always more comfortable when I take take something metaphorical (trance) and identify it in the physical and tangible, but that's me.
In my always present determination to take metaphors and make them tangible and concrete, I think of hypnosis as being the brain wave state that exists between a waking state and a sleeping state.
Susan
.
-
Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on
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Hi -
Great topic and some interesting input-
Like Adrian -- I am surprised this discussion has not generated more interest??
How easy it is to forget that all of the functions of mind that we are discussing here are models. I believe that the simplest model is likely to be the best model which is why I view hypnosis as a persuasive art empowered by the power of suggestion.
Early on, I realized that the notion of "waking hypnosis" only seems like an oxymoron, if we forget that the word hypnosis is a misnomer. One might consider that we are always hypnotizing ourselves and others whenever we communicate with ourselves or others.... Which brings me to "Trance"
I believe that our experience of life is a complex of the every day social and personal trances that inform our experiences without our being aware that we are in trance. Keeping in "mind" our perceptions, beliefs and expectations create our experiences of "reality" -- I view trance as any state of being in which our neurology is processing input or acting on previous programming without the awareness of the processing or acting on... Ancient wisdom talks of a waking sleep which I see as another way to represent "trance states" In my opinion - human beings are in various levels of "trance" whenever we are not in the "moment" or "present" -- In other words, whenever we are automatically reinforcing or changing or acting on our perceptions, beliefs and/or expectations with or without being aware of it...
FYI- I developed QUANTUM FOCUSING to help clients discover that they were going through their lives on auto-pilot rather than being in the moment -- the dual goal is to get back into the habit of being in the moment and creating healthier and more effective trances for when we are back on auto-pilot....
Michael E.
Adrian Tannock said:!!**Amazed that people who purport to use a specific medium each day have little interested in wanking on about what it might actually be**!!
I need to find a geekier forum, obviously...
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Permalink Reply by Kelley Woods on
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As Michael so eloquently presents, and I also relate to trance: a state wherein a person functions automatically...and I find that I often operate under the premise that it is my function to "de-trance" the subject!
Michael Ellner said:Hi -
Great topic and some interesting input-
Like Adrian -- I am surprised this discussion has not generated more interest??
How easy it is to forget that all of the functions of mind that we are discussing here are models. I believe that the simplest model is likely to be the best model which is why I view hypnosis as a persuasive art empowered by the power of suggestion.
Early on, I realized that the notion of "waking hypnosis" only seems like an oxymoron, if we forget that the word hypnosis is a misnomer. One might consider that we are always hypnotizing ourselves and others whenever we communicate with ourselves or others.... Which brings me to "Trance"
I believe that our experience of life is a complex of the every day social and personal trances that inform our experiences without our being aware that we are in trance. Keeping in "mind" our perceptions, beliefs and expectations create our experiences of "reality" -- I view trance as any state of being in which our neurology is processing input or acting on previous programming without the awareness of the processing or acting on... Ancient wisdom talks of a waking sleep which I see as another way to represent "trance states" In my opinion - human beings are in various levels of "trance" whenever we are not in the "moment" or "present" -- In other words, whenever we are automatically reinforcing or changing or acting on our perceptions, beliefs and/or expectations with or without being aware of it...
FYI- I developed QUANTUM FOCUSING to help clients discover that they were going through their lives on auto-pilot rather than being in the moment -- the dual goal is to get back into the habit of being in the moment and creating healthier and more effective trances for when we are back on auto-pilot....
Michael E.
Adrian Tannock said:!!**Amazed that people who purport to use a specific medium each day have little interested in wanking on about what it might actually be**!!
I need to find a geekier forum, obviously...
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Permalink Reply by John Cleesattel on
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Hi Adrian,
At least it generated more interest than the last time I posted a discussion on in back in April 2009, and only got 6 replies
http://www.hypnothoughts.com/forum/topics/what-is-trance-really
John
Adrian Tannock said:!!**Amazed that people who purport to use a specific medium each day have little interested in wanking on about what it might actually be**!!
I need to find a geekier forum, obviously...
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