the Free Hypnosis Social Network
What is trance?
Every now and then I encounter people who have varying opinions of what trance is and how it works. Just today I have read here where people think sleep is trance, or think that hypnosis doesn't need to involve trance at all.
So just what is trance?
In my formal training, I was taught "trance begins with 3 words....close...your...eyes." I have since found out that I was given misinformation about what trance was, and so that started me questioning everything, doing my own research, and writing a book about it, but that's another story.
Needless to say, that my own personal findings indicated that trance is a natural state for us as a species. Since the analytical mind can only focus on one thing at a time, we have to use a trance state to be able to multi-task.
Trance is simply a state where the reactive mind (subconscious) automatically reacts to outside input. Hypnosis takes advantage of this by realizing the outside input can be in the form of a suggestion.
To me; hypnosis is simply the means to induce a purposeful trance state. So it doesn't matter what method you use, if you have induced a trance state in someone, you have hypnotized them.
In our everyday lives, we are well used to using trance states with the conscious mind very active and aware.
Trance has nothing to do with if the eyes are open or shut, if you are nervous or relaxed, or anything else like that. The reason we use commands like sleep, relax, etc. is because for the most part, the subject is very familiar with the terms and understands how to automatically react to them, and it turns the focus of their mind further inside.
When ever our conscious mind is focused on something, especially on the inside of the body, a trance state HAS TO exist in order for us to keep maintaining.
A trance state does not bypass the critical factor unless the magnitude of the trance state (depth?) is sufficient to shut down that filter. We refer to that magnitude of trance as somnambulism, and during somnambulism our ability to determine what is real and true is impaired (what we call "the critical factor") which is why we get the trance effects and results we get with it.
I realize that we all have our models of hypnosis and trance, this is mine, and I would love to hear how you define trance.
John
So just what is trance?
In my formal training, I was taught "trance begins with 3 words....close...your...eyes." I have since found out that I was given misinformation about what trance was, and so that started me questioning everything, doing my own research, and writing a book about it, but that's another story.
Needless to say, that my own personal findings indicated that trance is a natural state for us as a species. Since the analytical mind can only focus on one thing at a time, we have to use a trance state to be able to multi-task.
Trance is simply a state where the reactive mind (subconscious) automatically reacts to outside input. Hypnosis takes advantage of this by realizing the outside input can be in the form of a suggestion.
To me; hypnosis is simply the means to induce a purposeful trance state. So it doesn't matter what method you use, if you have induced a trance state in someone, you have hypnotized them.
In our everyday lives, we are well used to using trance states with the conscious mind very active and aware.
Trance has nothing to do with if the eyes are open or shut, if you are nervous or relaxed, or anything else like that. The reason we use commands like sleep, relax, etc. is because for the most part, the subject is very familiar with the terms and understands how to automatically react to them, and it turns the focus of their mind further inside.
When ever our conscious mind is focused on something, especially on the inside of the body, a trance state HAS TO exist in order for us to keep maintaining.
A trance state does not bypass the critical factor unless the magnitude of the trance state (depth?) is sufficient to shut down that filter. We refer to that magnitude of trance as somnambulism, and during somnambulism our ability to determine what is real and true is impaired (what we call "the critical factor") which is why we get the trance effects and results we get with it.
I realize that we all have our models of hypnosis and trance, this is mine, and I would love to hear how you define trance.
John
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Walt Potter on
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Hugh,
This is beautiful poetry!
I'm riding on a surface, watching the normals flow by, iteratively searching for the peak. The surface and I interact.
You've really triggered my imagination!
Rapid induction is finding and following a geodesic.
Walt
Hugh Cole said:Walt
Words are INDEED extremely important to what the client and, more importantly the Hypnotist perceives, For my own Model I like to think of trance as a state, or more importantly like a series of states. and hypnosis as the process that accesses those states. To a mathamatican I would say Trance is like an Eigenvector { trance(a), trance(b)...} and Hypnosis is the transform function operating on the vector. You don't need the function to have the vector exist and different functions access and change differant coordinates of the vector.
Don's view which I like very much is like a assigning an expectancy vector to the coordinate of the Eigenvector called "imaginative involvement". As you drive the Matrix in the direction of increased (intensified) imaginative involvement , quality of trance and emotional responsivness tend to peak.
This is not the bug eyed authoriarian approach we discussed on another (more heated) thread. Don's views allows for the subjects inate responses to be the driving force as the hypnotist suggestions becomes more of an envelope around the subjects responses.
Said differantly ... hyper emperia works great and opens doorways that are very helpful in both waking and "tranced out" forms of the hypnotic process.
Hugh Cole
Making them dizzy one post at a time.
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Permalink Reply by Fable Goodman on -
Walt Potter said:Hugh,
This is beautiful poetry!
I'm riding on a surface, watching the normals flow by, iteratively searching for the peak. The surface and I interact.
You've really triggered my imagination!
Rapid induction is finding and following a geodesic.
speaking of geodesics...
Buckminster Fuller once said to me...
"Fable you are a nice guy and I like you a lot, but I have this one piece of advice"
I said what's that Bucky?
and he said:
" for god sake stop name dropping!"
the funny thing was that Milton had said the same thing just a few days beforehand.
I am sure they were trying to tell me something,
but I havn't quite worked it out yet.
Love and hugs,
Fable
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Permalink Reply by Don Gibbons, Ph.D. on -
Hi Hugh,
One of the reasons that I like to write is it helps me to find out what I am thinking. (Hypnotists understand that.) One of the reasons I enjoy these discussions is that other people help me to find out what I am thinking. Thanks for showing me!
The Best Me Technique, however, loads multimodally, enabling us to drive the Eigenvector using a souped-up six-cylinder model powered by Belief systems, Emotions, Sensations and physical perceptions Thoughts and images, Motives, and Expectations.
Don
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Permalink Reply by Hugh Cole on
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Fable
You are .... One of a kind .. I am glad you are my friend
Hugh Cole
Keeping it interesting
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Don
I have to say that since I saw your mystical therapy script and began playing with the differant constants and forcing functions I could write based on BEST ME to control the 'envelope" of imaginative involvement, I have seen some pretty dramatic peaks of imaginative involvement.. In fact I believe I have caused a singularity on one occasion.
Hugh Cole
The Pretty Goodest Hypnotist on the Planet
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Hugh, Don,
Would you point us to the mystical therapy script?
Thanks, Walt
Hugh Cole said:Don
I have to say that since I saw your mystical therapy script and began playing with the differant constants and forcing functions I could write based on BEST ME to control the 'envelope" of imaginative involvement, I have seen some pretty dramatic peaks of imaginative involvement.. In fact I believe I have caused a singularity on one occasion.
Hugh Cole
The Pretty Goodest Hypnotist on the Planet
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Permalink Reply by Henxy on -
GIL BOYNE said: advisers recently recommended its use on the NHS to treat irritable bowel syndrome.
...And yet (as far as I know), I'm the only NHS hypnotherapist in Primary Care (and I know of only 1 other NHS HT, and she works only 3 days a month for the hospital).
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Permalink Reply by Don Gibbons, Ph.D. on
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Walt and Hugh,
Am glad for the feedback that The Mystical Therapy article is finding some interesting applications. The article and script are in the first issue of the Journal of Experiential Trance, which is available for free download at www.trancesociety.org/journal.
Don
Walt Potter said:Hugh, Don,
Would you point us to the mystical therapy script?
Thanks, Walt
Hugh Cole said:Don
I have to say that since I saw your mystical therapy script and began playing with the differant constants and forcing functions I could write based on BEST ME to control the 'envelope" of imaginative involvement, I have seen some pretty dramatic peaks of imaginative involvement.. In fact I believe I have caused a singularity on one occasion.
Hugh Cole
The Pretty Goodest Hypnotist on the Planet
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Don,
Thank you for the pointer. The whole journal is there for download!
Walt
Don Gibbons, Ph.D. said:Walt and Hugh,
Am glad for the feedback that The Mystical Therapy article is finding some interesting applications. The article and script are in the first issue of the Journal of Experiential Trance, which is available for free download at www.trancesociety.org/journal.
Don
Walt Potter said:Hugh, Don,
Would you point us to the mystical therapy script?
Thanks, Walt
Hugh Cole said:Don
I have to say that since I saw your mystical therapy script and began playing with the differant constants and forcing functions I could write based on BEST ME to control the 'envelope" of imaginative involvement, I have seen some pretty dramatic peaks of imaginative involvement.. In fact I believe I have caused a singularity on one occasion.
Hugh Cole
The Pretty Goodest Hypnotist on the Planet
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Susan,
Check out ultradian rthyms, E. Rossi.
He has a book "The 20 Minute Break".
Walt
Susan French said:Hi John,
My information said that we drift into hypnosis every 90 minutes for about 15 minutes. Is that incorrect? I'll to find where I read it.
Thanks,
Susan
John Cerbone - The Trance-Master said:We are going into Hypnosis/Trance every 22 minutes for some moment of time.
For years here in NYC, there has been an AM News-Station which says, "Give us 22 minutes, and we'll give you the World."
It occured to me, after 22 minutes, the average person is in relaxation/trance/hypnosis, so 22 minutes is about all they are going to get before the subconscious kicks in anyway, as the mind wanders and relaxes, as the critical mind is taking a break. LOL
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Permalink Reply by John Cleesattel on -
Walt,
Although I use the terminology "trance state", I don't really mean state of mind as in attitude or even altered state. It is more a receptive/compliant state. Altered doesn't fit because it is a normal state for us that we use all the time, that doesn't affect our consciousness. Instead, it frees our consciousness to do other things.
The closest example I can think of, is that Trance is like a babysitter, so the intellect can go (focus) somewhere (anywhere) else, and we will automatically react to what we encounter in the way we learned how, when it is active.
Hypnosis simply amplifies this natural trance (receptive/reactive) state of ours to accept suggestions in the same way it accepts other outside input. It really seem to just turn trance into a heightened state of automatic compliance. The key operative word being "automatic".
As you have experienced with the "experience trance" video I put on here, your conscious mind is still quite functional during this trance state. The analytical mind, including the critical factor and short term memory, goes dormant when we give the sleep command, because that's what it does when we sleep.
The control of what we comply with, and how compliant we are, seems to reside in what I call the judgmental mind, which is the decision making center of our mind. The judgmental mind appears to be able to control if we will be compliant at all, and how compliant we will be, to the input or suggestion.
The deepening is consciously complied with at first, and then more automatically compliant as the state gets amplified and the input source becomes more trusted.
To limit describing this reaction to suggestion alone, would lessen the perceived magnitude that trance really is. We respond to suggestion, only after an amplification (deepening) of an existing trance state.
The reason I made the video is so people can prove to themselves what trance really is, instead of me trying to prove it to them. Talk is cheap.
John
Walt Potter said:All,
Many good things going on here and I'm learning a lot. So my comments below are about me trying to learn as opposed to speaking with any kind of knowledge.
I'd like to make a couple of definitions. For me a definition has no content. It simply limits the meaning of the words I want to use. If the definitions happen to be useful in understanding "reality", all the better.
(T) Trance is a state of mind. So we're always in some trance(state). On this page let's allow the words trance and state of mind to mean the same thing.
Trances have qualities, some are useful for some good things. Maybe the word trance gets in our way if we make it different from other states of mind.
I want to take the point of view that hypnosis has some utility. Doing hypnosis is a goal directed activity.
(HT) Hypnotic Trance is a state of mind where one accepts suggestions. Deep hypnotic trances are in effect when the usual critical thought patterns are more suspended. One is more prone to accept suggestions.
One is always, to some degree, in a hypnotic trance. The word suggestion is a nominalization of suggest. There are two involved; one who suggests, one who accepts the suggestion; and the suggestion. Thus rapport is important. Of course the two may be one and we have self hypnosis. The key concept here is suggestibility. Given the mind-body connection we may expect to see physical manifestations of a deep hypnotic trance.
(HTI) Hypnotic Trance Induction is a process that deepens the hypnotic trance, making the subject more likely to accept the target suggestion. (I've been told that Albert Einstein's sister once said that a hypnotic trance should be as deep as necessary, not deeper.) Often one starts with suggestions that are easy to accept, chaining them together until the desired state is reached. At each step one hopes to reduce the influence of the critical thought processes. The more one accepts, the deeper one goes and.... Why this chaining is effective is interesting. Pointing out to the subject that they are going into a deeper hypnotic trance is useful. Confusion is useful in deepening the hypnotic trance. (Often confused, I'm often in a hypnotic trance.)
It may be that there are different hypnotic trances, and different inductions lead to those different states, allowing different utilization. In one case a rapid induction may be called for, in another a metaphoric induction might be useful.
How does one measure the quality of an induction? Probably depends on the goal. There's probably not a best one. However, having a best one would be a nice surprise.
Well I think I understand more now. However a friend of mine believes that our intelligence is inversely proportional to the size of the group we're in. When where alone we're smart, when there are others around to point out our errors...
I'm by myself right now, about to join 5000. Let me know,
Walt
(A little short in the tooth in this business.)
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John,
An old post. I'm surprised how much I've learned since October.
Your comment:
The control of what we comply with, and how compliant we are, seems to reside in what I call the judgmental mind, which is the decision making center of our mind. The judgmental mind appears to be able to control if we will be compliant at all, and how compliant we will be, to the input or suggestion.
Is interesting. How do you convince the judgmental mind to go along with things? Or is it all up to the judgmental mind?
I know that when I looked at your video I decided to go along for what ever ride was being offered. I was quite surprised when you said freeze. I did, when I thought of moving, my mind just skipped away. Good video.
Walt
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