You might NOT want to answer this!

Hi guys,

This question is mainly for working therapists, who believe that they should test for evidence of hypnosis through phenomena or experiential trance, prior to therapy taking place.

As the title says, you guys might NOT want to answer this, and I would fully understand.

Indeed I don't really expect this thread to last too long.

I worded the above question in such a way because, as you well know, different situations get different results. ie: if I'm at a barbeque and someone recognises me and the shout goes up and I'm asked to do some hypnosis AND I agree, then it normally works like this: if the first one 'goes', very rarely will I NOT get over 90% going into hypnoses and very often 100% (all volunteers). And to be honest I think with experienced impromptu hypnotists nearly all would agree with that.

But, here's the question:

They enter the 'therapy room' and you do your suggestability tests or whatever you do. What percentages do you believe you hit? Remember I'm talking to the level of phenomena or experiential trance, NOT relaxa-therapy (although there's nothing wrong with that).

I'm asking this question THIS WAY because I was told today that there are many that have REGULAR success rates between 95-100%.

I hypnotised my first person in 1977. I am an extremely confident hypnotist who has worked impromptu, stage and of course am a working therapist.

BUT of everyone I have asked to date I am definitely the poorest (LOL)! I don't have the stats but I think I personally would be hitting about 4 out of 5 (80%) in the therapy room, first session. (I claim of course that there are reasons why I simply cannot hypnotise 1 out of 5, but that might be viewed by some as an excuse. LOL).

Please don't anyone reply informing us that it's NOT necessary for them to develop phenomena for the sake of therapy. We know that, but thankyou.

But if you could take a minute to post what you honestly believe, that'd be great.....

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Permalink Reply by Ricky Strode on April 30, 2011 at 3:31pm

I know you can do much better than that. I think if you could video tape a few different videos of how you do what you do, then many of us could make that 80% a 100%.

Happy Trancing,

Ricky W. Strode

Your In-Trance to Success

http://yourin-trance.com/

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Permalink Reply by bob burns on April 30, 2011 at 3:57pm

Just popped in again on passing and golly one person has answered already, fantastic.

So... Ricky Strode is 100%. First person I've ever met to actually claim that. I love it!!!

By the way, thanks for the offer of help. If you've got any clips showing your style I'd love to see 'em.

Thanks Ricky.

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Permalink Reply by John Cleesattel on April 30, 2011 at 9:30pm

Bob,

The induction I normally use incorporates trance phenomena as part of the induction, so there is no doubt. I have run across a few who have had issues that prevented them from releasing control and following my instructions, and that ended up either not wanting to fix it, or where I didn't have time to troubleshoot it.

If given the opportunity and the time, and they have the desire, I can get them all.

I do have videos on my page here if you would like to see my techniques

John

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Permalink Reply by bob burns on May 1, 2011 at 1:06am

Great post John,

And yes I think I agree totally

The actual question I posted could (perhaps should) have covered that in more detail. In that I'm happy to accept that the main REASON why an experienced hypnotist does not hit 100% is for the reason you touched on. ie: for whatever reason they simply can't let go.
You can see why many stage hypnotists talk of anything between 5 to 20% being somnambulistic and will not do a show unless there's a minimum of 100 people in the room.

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Permalink Reply by James Malone on May 1, 2011 at 8:05am

Bob, could you clarify the question for me a bit? Are we equating success with creating some sort of hypnotic phenomena on the first visit versus the overall success rate of therapy here? The former percentage I would suspect is quite high, especially for an experienced hypnotist and my best guess is that it happens for 80-90% of the clients I encounter. However, anyone claiming to have a 95-100% success rate with any type of therapy is entering the realm of "extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof." A skeptical type would justifiably ask for some verifiable supportive data as to that number such as a long term follow up protocol.. Jim

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Permalink Reply by Brochu on May 1, 2011 at 8:41am

Bob:

I must agree with James Malone.

Your Testimonial/ Setup is framed in such a way that you even state,

“Indeed I don't really expect this thread to last too long.”

Would the subject been better served by inviting other members to engage in a discussion rather than daring everyone to step into a quagmire?

It seems as if you have mistaken the sardonic method for the Socratic method in forming your questions.

I agree in spirit with you assertion that many Hypnotists over state their success rate. You are asking for hard data where it rarely exists. I believe that even when we try to track our results we must rely on client compliances to amass any numbers. Since we can’t tell you the validity coefficient of any numbers we amass they must be viewed as anecdotal at best.

I agree with your destination. Perhaps your can choose an easier road and clarify your question.

Yours in Health,

John Brochu

BrochuHypnosisCenter.com

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Permalink Reply by Graham Old on May 1, 2011 at 9:14am

Well, I'm gonna try and avoid questionning why we don't view relaxation as phenomena, because that's probably a debate left for another time. ;-)

However, are you saying that 20% of the time you get no phenomena at all? Or that 20% of the time you don't get the particularly phenomena you go for and have to try something else?

If the latter, then I'd say that I'm about 80% as well. If the former, I guess I'd say I'm 90-95%.

www.hypnosisnorthampton.com

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Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on May 1, 2011 at 9:19am

Hi Bob-

I am happy to answer your question - I induced "deep" trances before doing the "therapy' during the very early part of my practice. About 80% of my clients demonstrated "deep" trance behaviors and that was on par with the many seasoned hypnotists that I was in contact with at the time.

@ John and James

Great insights!

@ Ricky-

I assure you that I am not the only one who realizes that you are shall we say overstating your skills and abilities. This is a public forum and exaggerated claims of effectiveness that go unchallenged could discredit all of our reputations -- 100% success rate -- Give us a break...

Just saying...

Michael E. @ http://www.nycanxietyhypnosis.com

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Permalink Reply by Kelley Woods on May 1, 2011 at 9:33am

Hello Bob,

When I think about the phenomenal results I get working with clients, it occurs to me that they usually feel some hypnotic affect during pretalk and induction, the challenge is sometimes in the recognition and acceptance of it!

All of my work is done in a clinical setting so. of course, these clients arrive in a state of expectancy, prepared to pay with their hard-earned money and that gives a distinct advantage to us both.

I don't, however, believe that evidence of hypnotic phenomena guarantees success and there have been times in my practice when it is totally unnecessary. I'm fine with that.

:) Kelley

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Permalink Reply by Ricky Strode on May 1, 2011 at 9:50am

I never said I always get 100 percent the first attempt, I do not give up. My 100 percent is from untilizing what does not work the very first time around. I utilize everything even if it means doing something like progressive relaxation. I do however achive 100 percent success rate getting them to go into trance the first time I see them. I never said that my first attempt always worked, but I would say that it around 90-95 percent of the time. I have not came across someone I have not been able to hypnotize. The longest it has ever taken me what 25 minutes and that was my very first time. I never said I am better than anyone. I am actually rather ordinary to my own standards, but I have detemenation that is relentless. I use a combination of things and I am pretty sure we do things quite a bit differently. My pre-talk is an induction, then I do deep trance. That is what I probably use most of the time, except with those who are very analytical, which I just ask them what they are really into and use that as an induction.

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Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on May 1, 2011 at 9:53am

A quick hat tip to your insight -- Relaxation is a profound physiological response.

Bravo -

Michael E. @ http://www.nycanxietyhypnosis.com

Graham Old said:

Well, I'm gonna try and avoid questionning why we don't view relaxation as phenomena, because that's probably a debate left for another time. ;-)

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Permalink Reply by littleSHIN on May 1, 2011 at 12:04pm

i always wondered why it is so hard for a experienced hypnotist to get a 100% success rate.

assuming that with experience comes a ton of knowledge, this theoretical hypnotist should know a ton of different inductions including all the good and working NLPs and conversationals (using them as nouns on purpose).

and pls, i am not talking about hypnotist who use the same 3 techniques with the exact same wording over and over again ... hoping that the god of statistics is merciful.

so assuming that someone comes to this theoretical hypnotist with the request for help, this theoretical hypnotist has ALL the tools he/she needs to get him into deep trance on first sight.

i dare to say, that the one hypnotist who can get me into deep trance on first sight ... well ... or EVER, is the one who has a 100% success rate (a tinytinytiny inside joke).