Using Ambiguous Language, Mispronounced Words and Confusion

Don't let a trance state develop until I have counted all the way down from five... and you can respond to any form of counting... and notice how it develops in stages... with each count from five... and before (four) you three (free) yourself... and allow yourself to (two) go all the way in trance... you can discover what it means being at one now... with your thoughts and feelings and a deep sense of relaxation... as you notice that developing in its own special way... wondering as you wander comfortably... drifting and relaxing... whether you will go deeper with the words that I say or the spaces between the words...(then at the end of the induction)...and as you drift back to a sense of oneness you can rise up to (two) an awakeful state with each count...feeling a sense of threedom (freedom) and before (four) you come all the way back you can let go of the experience on a conscious level and end the counting on five...then opening your eyes...

As you wander along wondering where the wandering will take you, you can wonder what else you will discover as I talk to ...your unconscious (a command to be unconscious/in trance)...mind, it is your right to decide whether your right (correct or right) hand will lift up or your left hand will lift up, and you know which hand is right (correct or right) and the right (correct or right) hand can lift while the wrong hand will be left ...(left hand is wrong/wrong hand will stay where it is) where it is, and you came here today and noticed that it is a nice day for a change (good outside, good day to change)...not like the other day where the weather just makes you wonder whether ...it is worth the change (command that it is worth changing and money change) ... you spend on tents (tense) when it takes all that effort to put them up and tents (tense) come down so easily and effortlessly, and you can take the tents (tense) down in so many ways it's impossible not to be able to take the tents (tense) down...and as you glisten (listen - Commonly used by Bandler) up to each word I say and be calm (become) aware of what it is like to wear something different and try on something new and wonder where you'll wear that...in what situations and what contexts...and in a minute you can take an (on) hour (our) ... discussion and the meaning and discoveries you have made and discoveries you don't know that you have made and wander (wonder) through what's new and realise that 70% of discomfort is made up of comfort (discomfort = 10 letters, comfort = 7 letters) and I wonder what that will mean to you the next time someone is mean to you and you take their meaning and pick up what they mean in a new way a way you didn't know you knew...dismissing the dis (common youth term - dissing you - meaning putting you down or being mean to you) and discovering (diss covering - hiding it) the comfort in yourself...

I enjoy mispronouncing words that most people seem to overlook or not notice

'You can take every trance (chance) you get to really relax'
'I don't know if that movement will be in the lift (left) hand or the right hand'
'I don't know which hand will lift right arm (on) up into the air'
No more/know more
insecurity/in security
Nowhere/Know where
Tents/Tense
Wonder/Wander
Stairs/Stares
In trance/Entrance
Heal/Heel
Changing state, or going from state to state etc... (Driving down USA for example - changing states of mind)

Tags: confusion, dan, dynamic, erickson, ericksonian, ernest, healing, hypnosis, hypnotherapy, ideo, More…jones, milton, rossi

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Permalink Reply by dan jones on April 1, 2009 at 8:56am

Hi,

Yes to the first part (although done from text is a bit more challenging to hide than if it is done face to face). Mainly it was to show/stimulate the difference between if I was directly telling you to have arm movement and indirectly stimulating it.

Yes most of Mckennas CD's have backwards counting, it is a way of creating focus, distracting you, while what he says will be deepening the trance and working on the issue.

Many therapists also use counting for the same reason.

Permalink Reply by Blankfrost on April 1, 2009 at 10:14am

so when you listen to the CDs it is best to focus on the counting and let the voice go on in the back ground? they mostly start from 300 but i find myself switching between the counting and the voice and then i just forget about the counting and listen to the voice but i think thats the wrong way? is it right to count all the way to 0 from 300 but then you wouldn't be able to focus on what the hypnotist is saying?

Permalink Reply by Blankfrost on April 1, 2009 at 10:25am

hmm i was wondering if the idea of confusion and distraction in hypnosis is true then would this kind of thing happen in other places. for example you might be watching tv and a advert with a message comes on, but then you are distracted by what someone is saying on the radio, while the advert on the tv is playing. would the advert message still effect you while you were distracted by the radio?

or maybe your just watching or listening to a strange and confusing advert will the messgaes in that confusion strange advert influence you without you relizing it?

Permalink Reply by dan jones on April 1, 2009 at 10:57am

That does happen, adverts use anchoring with (usually) low intensity feelings so it needs many repititions, it is designed either to be in the background (like when you go to put on the kettle, because advertisers know this is what happens) and sink in with a jingle etc, or they will build an emotion as you watch, then slap a command or the product on screen at the end once the emotion has been raised. Some even get you to do regression to make you more suceptable by using representations of childhood toys or TV programmes (like transformers etc)
A confusing advert with a clear message or command at the end can work, as can an advert said rapidly (which is equally confusing) or full of jargon you don't understand (confusing again) followed by a command or showing the product on screen at the end so you have something solid.

The risk some advertisers make is that there can be a fine line between 'OK' confusion or emotion, and the add irritating you so that the anchored feeling is annoyance etc...

Permalink Reply by Blankfrost on April 1, 2009 at 1:07pm

what you said about the ambiuous counting even if your just having a normal chat will they feel like they are becoming more deeply relaxed after you done the ambiguous counting? does it work on anyone or do they have to maybe of been hypnotised with counting before so their brain makes that link?

many people who havn't been hypnotised before, see count downs as something else like maybe a students class teacher use to say "ok everyone settle down and pay atention 5,4,3,2 ect.." if the class was messing around and the punishment might be a detention or something? so if you were to do it abiguosly they would unconciously link it to doing it or else?
would that be right????

PS can someone answer my CD question please

Permalink Reply by dan jones on April 1, 2009 at 9:01pm

It generally doesn't matter too much, the hypnotist would be wanting you to become absorbed so whether you focus on the counting or the words you are likely to be absorbing yourself.

Often if the wording (like it is on Mckennas CD's) is to count then I think he often talks about counting but if you loose your place pick up roughly where you left of and continue and when you forget about the counting it doesn't matter. So in this situation I'd say it is good to follow the counting until you just instinctively seem to stop following it, not because you are deciding to follow the words but because your mind just goes quiet...

Permalink Reply by dan jones on April 1, 2009 at 9:15pm

I would only count in a session, even there there isn't really a need to do a counting based induction. Just hearing someone count down isn't going to induce hypnosis as they need to be told the counting is linked with going into hypnosis (or whatever state).

They may well (in the student example) link it to getting told off, only if the teacher was consistant and always used counting and when they were doing it now they used the same voice tonality etc...You see this often where the teacher walks into a room and just says '5' in a specific voice and everyone starts behaving because they know what is coming.

If on the other hand classes where always ended with a brief guided meditation and the teacher used counting in a specific voice then at anytime they want the class to relax, all they have to do is use that voice and either overtly or covertly (miss saying words etc) count down and the students would begin to respond and relax. This is good for young children where you can have a 'story time' and always start the story time in the same way like briefly counting relaxing down) and involve relaxation, then if the children become very active at another time the teacher can use the counting to induce that state.

As Erickson frequently demonstrated once the person knows counting from 10 -1 (for example) induces trance he would demonstrate that he can say things like 'ten student the other day were in a lecture and 6 of them decided it wasn't for them, the students left paid attention to what I was saying then just before I had finished 2 of them needed to go to see the principle. The two left listened to all I had to say and didn't leave until I finished talking...then they went off to their next class...' So he used maths (subtraction in this case) to induce trance. He also sometimes had it that counting to 20 would induce trance then he would do similar but with addition.

Permalink Reply by Blankfrost on April 3, 2009 at 11:49am

hey just to do with teh CDs again. some CDs have the speaker speak two different things in the left andd right ear which is very hard to keep track of you can't pay attention to both of the voices and it sounds like both of them are giving usseful seggestions? why do some CDs tent to do this? is there a great benifit?

Permalink Reply by dan jones on April 3, 2009 at 10:28pm

It's a double induction or process, where you direct comments or suggestions intended for different reasons to different places. So for example on McKennas CD's he often does this with talking to the conscious mind in one ear and the unconscious mind in the other ear so that the brain picks up and understands that the message it receives is for a specific purpose. I do this often with mine and always do it face to face (although face to face I obviously can't do it simultaniously.

Richard Bandler seems to often do double inductions and I've heard a really good induction once that was Richard and a German NLP Trainer simultaniously talking (One in English the other in German)

It also causes confusion and makes you have to let go consciously and just go with it because you can't follow everything all at once.

I love doing this process and find it makes me go much deeper much faster as I can't follow all of it at once.

I also will have voices coming from different places like over a shoulder, or in the front of the head etc, while a main voice talks in one location, or will have the deepener suggestions (like counting down) spinning round the head or lowering down (all can be done when the person wears headphones).

Permalink Reply by Antonio on April 10, 2009 at 4:00am

Blankfrost, cd's aren't really all that effective, unless they are made specifically for a person. Some people may experience some benefits. The problem with pre-recorded cd's that aren't made for a person is that they can't effectively work on a persons problem...lets say that not every induction works for a person, and there is a particular induction on a cd that isn't effective for person A but it may work for person B.