What's Wrong with a Good Regression?

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Craig Homonnay on June 2, 2010 at 8:00pm

I love what you just Said Kelley
"In my practice, I find that I often utilize regression. I don't always use it in a formal manner, but allow my client to follow feelings"
That is precisely the way I like to do it . Follow their deepest feelings ,because those feelings are attached to every other time in their life they have ever felt this way ....
.Teach them how to release those feelings from events in their past ( and Present )

"4. The case of a hypnotherapist using regression against a client's wishes"

I Always educate the client about what we will be doing before we do the work , I DO NOT believe what so many Regression Guru's teach ...That we should not tell the client that we are going to regress them .....I would never do that to anyone !
I prefer to teach the client why we may use Regression ....
What they can expect and how we are going to release any feelings that come up during the session.
I want them to know that we will be working with their feelings and helping them get to the root cause of those feelings. So we can release them, and they can move forward in their life towards what they truely want .

Permalink Reply by Susan French on June 3, 2010 at 4:57am

Kelley,

Thank you for broaching this often controversial subject. You and Craig both hit on the problems with the techniques as they are presently taught. In using age regression as I had been taught formally and as I seemed to find everywhere I researched for more updated techniques, I floundered.

You didn't mention the big one, the one that put me off regression: that frequently clients had a negative reaction and I didn't know how to complete the process well enough to bring them to a positive place after the hornet's nest was stirred.

Even with clients who wanted regression, my clients were becoming what I was later to learn, retraumatized. Many never came back to finish the process. If you work within a one-hour session time, I found that I couldn't predict and control the process enough to make certain they didn't have bad reactions during the week and that clients often dropped after regression.

Yet and still, I've always believed that there was a lot of value to regression and affect bridge but I had had enough negative reactions that I stopped using it.

I would love to hear how you, Craig and anyone else who has modified the technique have learned to bring the clients back to old memories (and especially old feeling patterns that aren't working anymore) and not leave them in the old, bad feelings. I definitely do not like the old "beat the pillow" and puke out old stuck negative feelings by reliving them techniques. I find them unpredictable and inconsistent.

I've found that that particular therapeutic mode is outdated, has been long abandoned in the psychotherapy community because of its inadequate or negative results. However, I had not yet had the time to figure out how to use regression in a safe and effective way.

Any and all ideas, techniques, etc, would be really, really appreciated by me because I know it's a valuable resource but I've become afraid of using it. The closest I've been able to get is to use NLP techniques with watching on TV screens, etc. Where I still find it lacking is in getting the client from the old wounds to reprocessing, reframing and relief in a consistent way.

Thanks in advance,

Susan
http://www.hypno4success.com

Permalink Reply by Kelley Woods on June 3, 2010 at 5:51am

Hi Susan,

I love you ~ you always pay attention and go right to the heart of the matter.

I have found that I mention a possibility of going into the past to gain insight or change perspective during my pretalk with a client. I don't usually say the word "regression" in case there are pre-conceived ideas that might be associated. Clients most often just nod in understanding and I continue on.

Using affect bridge is my most common avenue; I phrase it: "thinking about the feelings associated with (issue)." Once the client advises he is "there", I ask if he is looking through his own eyes or if he is watching himself. If the event is traumatic I move him into that observer position (I might ask him if it's safer to do so...) The first thing I do is bring him together with his younger self, over in a private place, and let the bonding happen.

This is when a huge amount of healing and ego-strengthening occurs. From this point on, the client is better equipped to deal with the trauma, no longer feeling alone and helpless, but part of a team, so to speak. If another party is involved in the event, it is easy to move into a gestalt situation to address and release feelings, during which both the younger and current selves get a chance to speak. It may not even be appropriate or required to continue on with the event, which is often where clients are re-traumatized, as you mention.

Susan, even when the past event isn't so traumatic, it's usually helpful for the client to connect with that younger self. This is just one way I use "the past" to heal and empower clients...

:) Kelley

Susan French said:

Kelley,

Thank you for broaching this often controversial subject. You and Craig both hit on the problems with the techniques as they are presently taught. In using age regression as I had been taught formally and as I seemed to find everywhere I researched for more updated techniques, I floundered.

You didn't mention the big one, the one that put me off regression: that frequently clients had a negative reaction and I didn't know how to complete the process well enough to bring them to a positive place after the hornet's nest was stirred.

Even with clients who wanted regression, my clients were becoming what I was later to learn, retraumatized. Many never came back to finish the process. If you work within a one-hour session time, I found that I couldn't predict and control the process enough to make certain they didn't have bad reactions during the week and that clients often dropped after regression.

Yet and still, I've always believed that there was a lot of value to regression and affect bridge but I had had enough negative reactions that I stopped using it.

I would love to hear how you, Craig and anyone else who has modified the technique have learned to bring the clients back to old memories (and especially old feeling patterns that aren't working anymore) and not leave them in the old, bad feelings. I definitely do not like the old "beat the pillow" and puke out old stuck negative feelings by reliving them techniques. I find them unpredictable and inconsistent.

I've found that that particular therapeutic mode is outdated, has been long abandoned in the psychotherapy community because of its inadequate or negative results. However, I had not yet had the time to figure out how to use regression in a safe and effective way.

Any and all ideas, techniques, etc, would be really, really appreciated by me because I know it's a valuable resource but I've become afraid of using it. The closest I've been able to get is to use NLP techniques with watching on TV screens, etc. Where I still find it lacking is in getting the client from the old wounds to reprocessing, reframing and relief in a consistent way.

Thanks in advance,

Susan
http://www.hypno4success.com

Permalink Reply by Craig Homonnay on June 3, 2010 at 3:42pm

Hi Susan
I would really need 10 pages and to answer this properly  but I will try and keep it short

“You didn't mention the big one, the one that put me off regression: that frequently clients had a negative reaction and I didn't know how to complete the process well enough to bring them to a positive place after the hornet's nest was stirred.

Even with clients who wanted regression, my clients were becoming what I was later to learn, retraumatized. Many never came back to finish the process. If you work within a one-hour session time, I found that I couldn't predict and control the process enough to make certain they didn't have bad reactions during the week and that clients often dropped after regression”.



First I would never just allocate just 1 hour to a session ……a session takes as long as it takes to get the work done properly,
Second In the set up ( Pre Talk ) you need to teach the client how to release these negative feelings from their body so they can feel so much better ….BEFORE they ever enter the hornets nest .
You teach them how to release their negative feelings with the Surface stuff they came into your office with First ..
Compound how much better they feel now that they have released it ….. As they become more confident in the process of feeling their negative feelings , releasing them ..and feeling better ….They will then be able to enter the hornets nest. Knowing that all feelings are generally short lived ..unless there is a resistance to feeling them ….and if they allow themselves to feel the feelings …let them run their natural course …and release them they will feel so much better …gain clarity ..and a new perspective
I DO NOT agree with the standard teaching that tells us not to release feelings until we have drilled back to the ISE because then you wont have an emotion to regress off …
That has not been my experience …and I think that also contributes to clients being retraumatized …..Give them the releasing tools before they really need them …so when the time comes to use them they are experts at it  ……make sure they know that if they do feel a little worse after a session that they should call you ….make sure that they feel comfortable knowing that they may actually feel a little worse after the session and that is just confirmation that their conscious mind and SCM are recalabirating their new understandings ….Give them the tools to be able to deal with this at home if the need arises ….if they call you because they are having trouble , you can help them over the phone with the skills you have conditioned them to use in your office



“I definitely do not like the old "beat the pillow" and puke out old stuck negative feelings by reliving them techniques. I find them unpredictable and inconsistent"
.
I wish I had a dollar for every Hypnotherapist that I have heard this from 
Firstly …how do YOU feel about using the pillow …are you projecting YOUR feelings about this method onto your client …if you are not comfortable with the pillow ..how can you expect your client to be ?
Again it all comes back to the set up ….I use a version of EFT for releasing as well as the Pillow and just body movement …..sometimes you just notice that your client is fidgeting in the chair ….maybe their legs are moving or their hands etc ….I just get them to move in any way in which their body is telling them to release even if that means getting them to run on the spot …….As long as after the release you compound how much better they feel and compound how well they are doing …..telling them …you can do this …you just proved it etc…..
I have found these releasing techniques both predictable and consistent …..as long as you SET IT UP


"I've found that that particular therapeutic mode is outdated, has been long abandoned in the psychotherapy community because of its inadequate or negative results. However, I had not yet had the time to figure out how to use regression in a safe and effective way".


We are not Psychotherapists or Psychologists etc
They work in the Conscious mind
Not the emotional feeling mind …If we do things the way they do it ,we will get the same results they get
We are Hypnotherapists …we do things different ….we are the last hope for most people
Psychotherapists etc abandoned the pillow because they didn’t know how to make it work consistently
They were however on the right track ….the trouble was all they did was hit the pillow
They didn’t do the extra work that we do as Hypnotherapists …..the forgiveness …finding the good …etc
And of course the direct suggestion work to compound it in …… If you use a medical model in your work you will get the same results they get ….
I have found that the only way to get consistent reliable results is to work with your clients …prepare them properly for what is to come ….and work with them at their pace ….making sure they are fully prepared ,ready and willing to do the work ….then let them astound you with their progress

Craig

Permalink Reply by Licentious Maladay on June 16, 2010 at 8:47am

I'm not a therapist. I don't do regression. Having said that, spontaneous regression happens. Suddenly you realize that your trancepartner has gone into the past.

It happened to me that I was helping my trancepartner with something blocking them when suddenly they were looking at themselves many years ago in a potentially traumatic moment. My suggestion was the same as my therapist had said to me, "Look at that person through the eyes of the adult you are now. Use all your learnings and experience now the way you would have back then." The person hugged the former version of themselves, asked for the object that was the cause of the trauma and then we dealt with it by changing its sub-modalities and throwing it into the sun.

Lic

Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on June 16, 2010 at 11:58am

Hi Kelley, et al,


1. Whether the hypnotherapist is versed in other techniques or only relies on regressive approach.

1) A generation of hypnotherapists have been and as far as I know still are being trained to believe that the only way to achieve long-term, meaningful results is to regress every client with a "serious" problem to cause and fix their problem -- These hypnotherapists seem to believe that anything than less than hypnotizing clients in the way that they have been taught is mal-practice.

2. How a regression has the potential to cause further damage to a client.

2) Tens of thousands of families were destroyed by shrinks and therapists who unknowingly installed false memories of sexual and physical abuse into their patients.

3. Limited application of regression technique.

3) As Susan pointed out, the Freudian model of repressed emotions and motivations that targeted regressive hypnotherapies are based, no longer reflect modern thinking about mental health and healing. The fact is that analytical theory and practice is rarely taught in medical schools today and as I type the "brain chemistry=mental illness" theories and practices are being challenged by (f)MRI studies and new research on CBT.

4. The case of a hypnotherapist using regression against a client's wishes.

4) I believe that using any hypnotic tool against a client's wishes violates our ethical codes and scope of practice.

FYI- I rarely use conventional regressive techniques, but I encourage my clients to go where the trance leads them and that often results in some regressive experiences.

And of course, that's just my opinion and experience.

Warmest regards,
Michael E.

Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on June 16, 2010 at 12:19pm

Any one else think that this is timely?


iaph- hypnoanalysis - HypnoThoughts.com
http://www.hypnothoughts.com/forum/topics/iaph-hypnoanalysis

Check out the iaph website--

Permalink Reply by Pete & Lorraine on June 16, 2010 at 12:25pm

We ask the SC to say where it needs to go via IMR. The majority of clients end up regressing. We don't use Freud that seems to be used by those doing Hypno Analysis, and going by another forum I can see why you are against regression based on Freuds work.

"FYI- I rarely use conventional regressive techniques, but I encourage my clients to go where the trance leads them and that often results in some regressive experiences."

It is very important to use clean language and not lead, putting in a safe place, dealing with what emerges, letting go of the emotional ties to that memory so letting go of the behaviour. Occasionally the SC will deal deal with it in the present tense.

Pete

Permalink Reply by Michael Ellner on June 16, 2010 at 3:35pm

Peter-

FYI -

I was an active member of the US National Institutes of Health's pioneering Community Research Initiative for AIDS Research from 1988 through 1992. We were studying the possible use, possible effectiveness and ways to mainstream effective alternative treatments for people with AIDS. I had contact with thought leaders in government and university medical research and in THEIR opinion "any one using IMR is operating in the realm of Ouija boards and palm reading..." Please note I am expressing "their" opinion.

That said, I fully respect and acknowledge that IMR can be very effective, in the same way that Hypno-Analysis, and just about any other hypnotic approach can be very effective when it utilized by a skilled hypnotist -- We empower the techniques that we use--

The secret ingredient in our techniques is our client's innate ability to respond to our suggestions with an excited imagination. Ben Franklin and the Royal Commission reached the same conclusion 226 years ago suggesting that "Animal Magnetism (A/K/A) Mesmerism "worked by the action of the imagination."

Michael E.

Peter Bateman & Lorraine Gleeson said:

We ask the SC to say where it needs to go via IMR. The majority of clients end up regressing. We don't use Freud that seems to be used by those doing Hypno Analysis, and going by another forum I can see why you are against regression based on Freuds work.
"FYI- I rarely use conventional regressive techniques, but I encourage my clients to go where the trance leads them and that often results in some regressive experiences." It is very important to use clean language and not lead, putting in a safe place, dealing with what emerges, letting go of the emotional ties to that memory so letting go of the behaviour. Occasionally the SC will deal deal with it in the present tense.
Pete

Permalink Reply by AJ on June 17, 2010 at 6:41am

1. Whether the hypnotherapist is versed in other techniques or only relies on regressive approach.
All successful hypnotists have learned the fundamentals of direct suggestion. Regression is an additional method that can be used to assist others.

2. How a regression has the potential to cause further damage to a client.
When a practitioner is poorly trained or insufficiently self taught then problems may result. The major problems occur when the operator improperly directs the regression.

3. Limited application of regression technique.
If anyone feels limited in her training, then she needs to get more.

4. The case of a hypnotherapist using regression against a client's wishes.
Everyone needs to understand that hypnotherapy requires proper communication with clients.

Permalink Reply by Pete & Lorraine on June 17, 2010 at 11:29am

Hi Michael
I have found IMR for the majority of the time to be very effective and occasionally led down a wrong path however I find a way round it getting the SC to take us to where we need to go some time via an emotion, with positive results. Oddly enough with the present topic, I had a client today whois doing well with no regression needed and is shedding weight, having already used some NLP to change her eating behaviours and direct suggestion,using IMR the SC agreed to the changes.
The problem I have with Hypno Analysis it appears to be so long winded the average course of sessions appears to be 10-12. On a forum in the UK there seems to be more complaints about this form of hypnosis than any other, it seems to focus on repressed sexual guilt. As you saw on another discussion my partner saw a Hypno Analyst and was not impressed.
As you say we empower the techniques we use, probably the reason I get a high number of regressions, which is a way I enjoy working with, though I do not consciously push for regression. It is in our (and our clients) best interest to have a selection of techniques, as some client do not like, even the idea of being regressed.
I guess at the end of the day, I will use what ever is needed to the best of my ability to help my client achieve a positive result.

Pete

Permalink Reply by Craig Homonnay on June 17, 2010 at 2:09pm

I dont know about anyone else ...most of my Clients average 3 to 5 sessions
10 to 12 sessions is just Ridiculous that is more like talk therapy time
The problem with a lot of Hypnotherapists is that they are very poorly trained
Even some of the main Hypnotherapy schools do not teach these methods adequately
See Doc Regals reply , he is spot on with his comments
Another thing that bugs me is when a Hypnotherapist uses techniques that they have not experienced themselves.
If you are going to use these techniques ...at least experience it yourself first ...judge for yourself if it works
Experience it as the client ... I have learned some of my biggest lessons from doing self work ...experience it from the clients perspective and you will know what works and what is just BS sprouted by those that have a product to sell

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